[Tiffani Toy]

Do you mean.as.in if.it happened.naturally there'd be no.worry opposed to self.induced feminization?
That's definitely.a.key problem for.her I.think..
Not.that she.knows I'm.feminizing.my body but she's not.dumb either
she believes none.at all herbs.can.do.anything.of.that matter
I.agree I understand she'd get curious.and wonder why I.picked.the one.I.can.hardly.even.say my only.hope.is.her to.search pueraria mirifica anxiety and.hope.breast growth doesn't.show.up.and she doesn't search side effects or.finds a thread of.pm and one I've posted on the periods would.give.me.away no matter how I'd change.my wording.from.how.I.speak lol

[flamesabers]

Do you mean.as.in if.it happened.naturally there'd be no.worry opposed to self.induced feminization?

I think if you were experiencing a natural feminization I think she would have far less motive to be upset with you. She might ask you to seek medical treatment to stop/reverse the process, but I think that would be far different than if your feminization was self-induced.

Another way of looking at this is the difference between having a condition that makes your hair fall out versus choosing to shave your head. You would still be bald either way, but with the former you didn't have a role in the outcome.

That's definitely.a.key problem for.her I.think..
Not.that she.knows I'm.feminizing.my body but she's not.dumb either
she believes none.at all herbs.can.do.anything.of.that matter
I.agree I understand she'd get curious.and wonder why I.picked.the one.I.can.hardly.even.say my only.hope.is.her to.search pueraria mirifica anxiety and.hope.breast growth doesn't.show.up.and she doesn't search side effects or.finds a thread of.pm and one I've posted on the periods would.give.me.away no matter how I'd change.my wording.from.how.I.speak lol

I googled 'pueraria mirifica' and the terms breast enhancement and breast enlargement came up in both on the first page of the search results and the google ads. I think depending on how extensive her search will be, she will probably find this site sooner or later once she is looking for pueraria mirifica and its connection to male breast enlargement.

I think something to ask yourself is do you want her to find out about pueraria mirifica from you, or from someone on the internet?

[Tiffani Toy]

Guess it comes down to the whole telling a lie or hiding a secret routine of would you rather them find out from you or from someone else...
I searched PM Anxiety and breast enlargement still came up so thats a no no.
Only thing I have playing on my side is the fact she absolutely refuses to believe that herbs are strong enough to change the human body and have great effects. Calls them a gimmick, scam, lies to make money, etc.
Although I think once the changes become noticeable and if questioned I'm just going to have to sit down with her and hope for the best and tell her
"Babe you know I love you and I want to be with you forever, I know we have our issues and I have mine that are greater then probably any man you have been with. I dont want to hurt you, I dont want to lie to you, But the changes going on with my body I believe are reason for me to see a therapist (not tell her i did it just let it be known changes are happening and i need to see someone professionally) I dont know where this will take me or us, I do not want to be a woman, nor do i have the desire to transition, But i do feel femining, and i do have incredible urges to express this and the more this relationship makes me force to bottle it all in the more difficult it becomes to be me. You love me and I love you, I understand the femininity i choose to expose eyes to and you to may make you feel like im taking away from your femininity, or that you're not woman enough. Au contraire you are more then anything I could ever ask for, and i know this is difficult to take in, But i'm asking you to accept this, and walk with me down this path, not just my best friend but as my gf, if you can't i understand and i hope you understnad i am not trying to hurt you, i just need to find out why i think the way i do and need and wnat what i cant stop feeling the desire for."
orsomething like that

[flamesabers]

I think it's the intent in this case that carries more weight than the potential results. Even though she disbelieves in herbs being able to make a difference, it's clear you do. She may question why you are so willing (or maybe desperate?) to take herbs in the hope it will feminize your body.

Going to a therapist may be a good idea. You may also want to have her come along as well. However, I think you should be honest about your reasons to see a therapist. You have a feminine side you wish to express rather than you've been experiencing an accidental hormonal imbalance and you have a newfound desire to be feminine.

[Tiffani Toy]

She actually offered to.find and go to a therapist when I brought it up weeks ago before I cowardly revised my "belief" told her as well I have a feminine side inwish to express I could possibly not wear the clothes out but I would.love to wear the under garments and have my nails.done and hair done and.shave
wasvtoo much for her think I was pushing more down her throat then.she could bare. Like on here in person I spill too much over awl what should be simple few word reply
Even.thought about just when.we get home from.Chicago.Sunday on.Monday shave my.legs and arms and whenbshe sees it just stand up for myself and say I.have to.if indont express something ill explode. But I feel doing beforetalking would be more detrimental then talking then.doing

[Bawb]

My best guess is that when the brain gets the estrogen level it needs, that satisfies the "feminity deficit" to the extent that you don't need the other aspects, which were caused by your feminised brain wanting to externalise its feminity.

The only reason I am currently taking PM is to get the calm mental balance that I cannot achieve without it.

Do you remember how long it took you start getting that mental benefit from the PM?

Every time I start to take PM for a bit, I seem to lose the desire to feminize or even to continue taking PM within a few days... so I'm wondering if it's satisfying my brain that fast, or if I'm just getting concerned about my ability to present as a male.

[flamesabers]

Every time I start to take PM for a bit, I seem to lose the desire to feminize or even to continue taking PM within a few days... so I'm wondering if it's satisfying my brain that fast, or if I'm just getting concerned about my ability to present as a male.

I think it depends on how you feel while you're on pm. If you feel you've achieved the mental balance bryony is talking about, I'm inclined to favor the former. If you feel anxious and restless, I think the latter is more probable.

[bryony]

My best guess is that when the brain gets the estrogen level it needs, that satisfies the "feminity deficit" to the extent that you don't need the other aspects, which were caused by your feminised brain wanting to externalise its feminity.

The only reason I am currently taking PM is to get the calm mental balance that I cannot achieve without it.

Do you remember how long it took you start getting that mental benefit from the PM?

Every time I start to take PM for a bit, I seem to lose the desire to feminize or even to continue taking PM within a few days... so I'm wondering if it's satisfying my brain that fast, or if I'm just getting concerned about my ability to present as a male.

It only took a few days for me too. If you have the same problem as me, your choices are fairly limited. Cross dressing is pretty limited in its ability to satisfy the mental anguish. My choices are to either present as a male with gynecomastia but mentally stable or present as a "normal" male but suffering mental anguish.

B.

[bryony]

That is a brilliant idea. Cause honestly only reason.I incorporate pm is same thing mental calmness
"Babe I have very bad anxiety and stres (I do) and I was Googling and this natural herb came up a ton of places (it is advertised for anxiety as well how.I originally.found it) and was thinking of trying it out it seems to.work.just as well as medication just natural not synthetically lab created with chemicals.and such. Very cheap and.think.its worth a shot to help keep me at a more self peace instead of stressing and being upset all.the time...
sound alright?
Only issue I.know she'll Google it out.of.curiosity so.what do I say when.she brings up.the issue that this herb is also for feminization?
I really wish I.had.more of a spine damnit.lol.

Hi,

sorry for the late reply , but just to be clear, I would never advocate dishonesty to a loved one.

When my kids were small I instilled my major moral code in them, which was: "if you love someone, you don't lie to them, because lying is a form of hatred". Yes, its a bald statement, and it doesn't include harmless "white lies" that prevent you hurting people's feelings with "radical honesty", but it should be a basic tenet that you just don't lie to someone and pretend to yourself that you love them.

What I was suggesting was that you tell her the truth - if you know it - about your condition; that you will always have this desire to feminise, but the upside is that if you do actually take this estrogen-like herb it will make your breasts enlarge, but also satisfy your cravings and stop you needing to go through artifical forms of feminisation, and that you will be able to manage your appearance through, for example, compression undershirts.

I think.its more though her 1st bf cheated 2nd abused her ans now me the one who.wants to.express his.femininity physically lol its got to take a toll.on ones self worth to.get hit back to back.
wish I could.just shave my.legs and be like this is.me it upsets u yes but I've held.this in for my whole.life holding it any longer is just making.me.want to.do.it.more and leave this relationship so I can be who.I am are you going to look past my feminine side and see that u have an.overall man who.cares and loves u or see the physical.and run and leave. I have a feminine.side I want to express it I don't want to be a woman just want to physically accept ans let loose this side of.me

You've got to look at it from her side. Imagine you don't have the problem, but she does. What do you do one day when says she wants to take testosterone, deepen her voice, grow a beard and have a mastectomy? But, of course, she'll keep her "female parts" so you can still make love, but you'll have to put up with her bristly chin and mustache.

How would you take it?

Having pondered on that, and have a very honest internal dialogue about what you would do, maybe an honest discussion with her would be appropriate?

The trouble I find with many people with our problem is that it is all about us. We want to be women, we want to look pretty, express our femininity, and, by the way, we expect our wives, girlfriends, partners, to be understanding, supportive, sympathetic, and bend to our wishes.

Don't you think that's just a little bit selfish?

You are in the "fortunate" position of not having made a lifetime commitment. You are not married and you don't have kids.

Now and only now is the time for brutal honesty. If you tell this girl everything, do not lie, do not hold anything back, and apologise for former deceptions, she may, just may, decide to support you with her eyes wide open. Then, and only then, could you criticise her later.

If she is not willing to support you then you both need to know now, because your problem will not go away.

If, on the other hand, you carry on lying to her and feminise deceitfully, then it will all end horribly, and you could wind up being the second person to abuse this poor girl.

B.

[Tiffani Toy]

Far as lying equals hatred I find.this.completely false. There's some things in.life in which we just find too too difficult to tell another. Some are strong as hell while others are weak.in.coming forth with and.embarrassing shameful truth that devours their being because truthfully very very few relationships workout in this matter and
I know upfront she supports but will.never be with me.and.its the incredible.fear that keeps me in secret opposed to.telling.her
you know what we talked about weeks ago I think I do need a therapist just to.understand.this. any form.of.feminine.nature she opposes dearly even.when.I.cross.my legs I get the most stern looks its pathetic she preached how.she's so.open minded to others ways but anything I do or I am gets shunned
I agree more I wait more detrimental it becomes its just very scary going thru life in relationships in which we fall out of but find one we truly.love and want to be with forever only to.have an.underlying.g condition.such as this develop and knowing it will.disease the relationship totally instills.fear
I'm.an.honest person.never scared to.speak.my.mind no.filter but with this.I'm.way too.afraid I.just don't know.with our anniversary and birthdays coming.up.just scared to.kill.everything.emotionally