[bryony]

FFS is certainly an important option for some. But I've seen quite a few young and older transitioners that simply don't need it after about a year or two on HRT. They aren't going to be knockouts but most women aren't either. Keep in mind that first link, she was 22 months into HRT in that last pic too.

There are plenty that are passable without FFS and in these cases, you would never clock them unless you had hindsight. Confidence, voice, makeup, hair style, grooming, mannerisms.. make up such a huge percentage in passing in day to day life.

Unlke US, most people don't think about transgender issues, they just don't think "is that really a woman?" on a daily basis.

I'm sure you are right for a percentage... but do you really think that Kate as a male would have been as attractive relying solely on makeup and mannerisms? I don't!

Personally Trachael shave and FFS are WAY WAY ahead of SRS on my list. Who gets SRS first these days anyway? Most people are concerned with passing.

In the UK, people just can't afford surgery, generally, because it was mostly taken over by the state in the 1950s. Most people rely on the NHS who will fund SRS but not "cosmetic" surgery. This is crazy when you think about it... if you have a face like a boxer, what difference does the state of your genitalia make?

[aleah]

Personally Trachael shave and FFS are WAY WAY ahead of SRS on my list. Who gets SRS first these days anyway? Most people are concerned with passing.

In the UK, people just can't afford surgery, generally, because it was mostly taken over by the state in the 1950s. Most people rely on the NHS who will fund SRS but not "cosmetic" surgery. This is crazy when you think about it... if you have a face like a boxer, what difference does the state of your genitalia make?

Yeah that sucks, I missed the point you were trying to make in the OP but I agree, that is a dangerous policy because people going through NHS will feel like they need SRS because it's funded and in the program rather than being happy they can pass first. No wonder theres a few regret stories from UK.

FFS is far more important for most of the girls I've spoken to. Almost everyone who isn't passable with HRT alone gets FFS first.

Edit: Having read through Kate's story, that's sad about the state of SRS surgery. I have always heard highly of Dr Suporn and plan to go to him for FFS if and when I need it. I know 2 girls personally that are very happy with both his FFS and SRS results.

I'm not so worried about the price of surgery, kind of a good thing for me personally, if I'm not willing to work to save and wait a while, then do I really need it?

[Doll]

FFS is certainly an important option for some. But I've seen quite a few young and older transitioners that simply don't need it after about a year or two on HRT. They aren't going to be knockouts but most women aren't either. Keep in mind that first link, she was 22 months into HRT in that last pic too.

LOL.
My friend is lucky, she was very feminine even before she started on HRT. She's always had the most beautiful hair, even when she was known as "Mike". Haha! Getting breasts from HRT has only helped in her feminization!

I am personally against surgery of any kind. We just lost a woman we used to work for because she went to get Bariatric surgery to look good for her daughter's wedding. IMO, she wasn't large enough to actually NEED it. And the doctors acted like there were almost no risks involved. Three days later, after spending the entire time hooked up to life support, she passed away. They had knicked her bowel and she died of sepsis.

There's just too many risks to surgery. I know a lot of Transgenders plan on taking it all the way, and plan to get surgery one day down the road to become completely female, but I feel like continually getting surgery along the way is completely unnecessary. HRT can work miracles, and makeup can coverup whatever "flaws" you think you still have. Because real women have flaws, too.

I'm not sure what all these acronyms are, so excuse my ignorance. ^^; I can't even keep up with common internet slang these days (I JUST learned that SMH means "shakes my head").

[bryony]

FFS is certainly an important option for some. But I've seen quite a few young and older transitioners that simply don't need it after about a year or two on HRT. They aren't going to be knockouts but most women aren't either. Keep in mind that first link, she was 22 months into HRT in that last pic too.

LOL.
My friend is lucky, she was very feminine even before she started on HRT. She's always had the most beautiful hair, even when she was known as "Mike". Haha! Getting breasts from HRT has only helped in her feminization!

I am personally against surgery of any kind. We just lost a woman we used to work for because she went to get Bariatric surgery to look good for her daughter's wedding. IMO, she wasn't large enough to actually NEED it. And the doctors acted like there were almost no risks involved. Three days later, after spending the entire time hooked up to life support, she passed away. They had knicked her bowel and she died of sepsis.

There's just too many risks to surgery. I know a lot of Transgenders plan on taking it all the way, and plan to get surgery one day down the road to become completely female, but I feel like continually getting surgery along the way is completely unnecessary. HRT can work miracles, and makeup can coverup whatever "flaws" you think you still have. Because real women have flaws, too.

I'm not sure what all these acronyms are, so excuse my ignorance. ^^; I can't even keep up with common internet slang these days (I JUST learned that SMH means "shakes my head").

That's so true. Even worse in countries where the surgeon recommends and performs the surgery and makes a great deal of money out of it. If I was told that I needed some kind of procedure, I'd be inclined to see a surgeon and pay them to advise on the basis that whatever happened, they would not be performing it.

B.

[MonikaT]

Hi,

thought you all would be interested in this.

I just saw this perfect example of why I think FFS should be provided as an option (if costs are an issue) to SRS (though I don't particularly want to argue about it) at least - if I were young, single and wealthy, it's what I would go for.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-...woman.html

What a difference! Imagine the starting point with as much makeup as you can, and it still wouldn't convince me. The last ones though.... no problem.

B.

While I agree that FFS (for the benefit of those who are not familiar, that is facial feminisation surgery) is probably more important than SRS (sex reassignment surgery) for those who need it, I'm not entirely sure that video was the result of FFS. I have seen a lot of such videos on YouTube, and they are almost always a series of pictures of the changes brought on by hormone therapy. I suspect the author of that article made a lot of assumptions.

[AbiDrew85]

I suspect the author of that article made a lot of assumptions.

Yeah... Especially since anyone who actually knows anything about FFS knows that it's usually done all together as one or two major operations.

FFS may have contributed, but what people who don't understand these things don't get is just how much of a difference simple hair removal and HRT makes.

Especially hair removal. Male beards make ALLL the difference. I was actually taken completely for female earlier today all the way up till they got close enough to notice the little bit of beard shadow that I can't QUITE completely hide.

[aleah]

While I agree that FFS (for the benefit of those who are not familiar, that is facial feminisation surgery) is probably more important than SRS (sex reassignment surgery) for those who need it, I'm not entirely sure that video was the result of FFS. I have seen a lot of such videos on YouTube, and they are almost always a series of pictures of the changes brought on by hormone therapy. I suspect the author of that article made a lot of assumptions.

I've seen her transition several times before, always thought it was HRT alone. She never mentioned anything about FFS. So I'm inclined to agree.

She's not the only one to get such great results without FFS, some girls are just lucky without masculine features.

Plus as AbiDrew pointed out, hair removal of the beard can do more to feminize than anything, add to that properly shaped eye brows, a flattering natural hair style and most people would be surprised.