[joanna_s]

I´ve tried to find a clear answer whether or not green tea is anti-estrogenic but haven´t found it yet. At the moment I´m using spearmint tea to reduce DHT but do you guys think that it would be a good idea to also drink green tea? I´ve read somewhere that green tea works as an anti-androgen but also as an anti-estrogen.

Joanna

[VergeOfDiscovery]

I´ve tried to find a clear answer whether or not green tea is anti-estrogenic but haven´t found it yet. At the moment I´m using spearmint tea to reduce DHT but do you guys think that it would be a good idea to also drink green tea? I´ve read somewhere that green tea works as an anti-androgen but also as an anti-estrogen.

Joanna

From a quick survey of the results for "is green tea anti estrogenic" it looks like it is. Doesn't appear to anywhere near as impactful as something like boron though (in men).

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2848451/

http://www.healthline.com/health/low-tes...le-grains6

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4712861/

[Lotus]

GTE promotes aromatase.... (estrogen).

Green Tea-

promotes aromatase, increases GABA, promotes estrogen and estrogen target gene pS2 and PR-progesterone receptor, modifies signaling transduction pathways, antioxidant (relieves oxidative stress & reduces lipid oxidation), possess potent iron-chelating radical-scavenging and anti-inflammatory activities (polyphenol EGCG-Epigallocatechin 3-gallate- inhibits DHT) are powerful free radical destroyers, protects against neurological diseases. Green tea catechins ameliorate adipose insulin resistance, anti-androgen (inhibits DHT), stimulates beta-receptors at fat cells to increase release of lipids into the bloodstream, GTE induces liver glucuronidation (meaning a higher concentration in the liver). Green Tea displaces estradiol in SHBG, making a higher bioavailability of E2 Estradiol (in the blood) benefiting delivery to target tissues. I believe GTE acts more like a generic herbal version of spirolactone. The higher the EGCG content the stronger it's ability to fight disease.....look for 80-98% catechins in supplements.

I believe GTE acts like generic herbal version of spirolactone.



More info on green tea found here:
http://www.breastnexus.com/showthread.php?tid=21602&pid=194560#pid194560

[joanna_s]

GTE promotes aromatase.... (estrogen).

Green Tea-

promotes aromatase, increases GABA, promotes estrogen and estrogen target gene pS2 and PR-progesterone receptor, modifies signaling transduction pathways, antioxidant (relieves oxidative stress & reduces lipid oxidation), possess potent iron-chelating radical-scavenging and anti-inflammatory activities (polyphenol EGCG-Epigallocatechin 3-gallate- inhibits DHT) are powerful free radical destroyers, protects against neurological diseases. Green tea catechins ameliorate adipose insulin resistance, anti-androgen (inhibits DHT), stimulates beta-receptors at fat cells to increase release of lipids into the bloodstream, GTE induces liver glucuronidation (meaning a higher concentration in the liver). Green Tea displaces estradiol in SHBG, making a higher bioavailability of E2 Estradiol (in the blood) benefiting delivery to target tissues. I believe GTE acts more like a generic herbal version of spirolactone. The higher the EGCG content the stronger it's ability to fight disease.....look for 80-98% catechins in supplements.

I believe GTE acts like generic herbal version of spirolactone.



More info on green tea found here:
http://www.breastnexus.com/showthread.php?tid=21602&pid=194560#pid194560


Wow, thank you so much. Herbal version of spiro sounds like reason enough to keep on drinking. I guess I will continue my routine, 1 large mug of green tea 2 hours after breakfast, 1 large mug of Spearmint tea 1 hour after dinner.

Joanna

[aroundthebend]

I take 2 GTE (1000mg, 75% catechins) a day at lunch. Is that a useful dose for HBE? 

FWIW...I'd take GTE even if I wasn't doing HBE, it improves my mood and gives me an energy boost well beyond what you'd expect from the small amount of caffeine present in the extract.

[bathtub-alchemist]

Bioflavonoids tend to be highly unstable once tea has been brewed.  It's best to make your own.  The supplements aren't nearly as potential as they claim

[joanna_s]

Dear Lotus, your knowledge about green tea´s aromatase promoting properties is based on what? All the articles I found on the web claim just the opposite; green tea inhibites aromatase and because of that it is anti-estrogenic. 

[Lotus]

Did you not read the attached " more info on green tea " link I provided?.....the attached papers (in that link) explain why GTE is pro-aromatase. The science is there, i suggest you read it, more than once.

 Have you ever heard of second messengers?, they provide the one of the biggest sources of aromatase inside the mitochondrial matrix (cells). Forskolin is another pro-aromatase, it has the same pro-aromatase action as green tea.

I know GTE works, my blood tests proved it, my estrogen jumped from 500 pg/mL to over 800 pg/mL in 1 months time of adding it, that's a 16 fold increase.

Btw, not all green tea is the same, meaning quality, Google quality of tea brands. The polyphenols in GTE should not be overlooked or dismissed.

I've seen all the research on GTE, my information and results are my conclusions, I'm satisfied with it.

[joanna_s]

I didn`t mean to insult; I read the article but I´m not american and the scientific language is sometimes complicated. I was just wondering why there is so much opposite information available

J

[Lotus]

Dear Lotus, your knowledge about green tea´s aromatase promoting properties is based on what? All the articles I found on the web claim just the opposite; green tea inhibites aromatase and because of that it is anti-estrogenic. 

Did you not read the attached " more info on green tea " link I provided?.....the attached papers (in that link) explain why GTE is pro-aromatase. The science is there, i suggest you read it, more than once.

 Have you ever heard of second messengers?, they provide the one of the biggest sources of aromatase inside the mitochondrial matrix (cells). Forskolin is another pro-aromatase, it has the same pro-aromatase action as green tea.

I know GTE works, my blood tests proved it, my estrogen jumped from 500 pg/mL to over 800 pg/mL in 1 months time of adding it, that's a 16 fold increase.

Btw, not all green tea is the same, meaning quality, Google quality of tea brands. The polyphenols in GTE should not be overlooked or dismissed.

I've seen all the research on GTE, my information and results are my conclusions, I'm satisfied with it.

I didn`t mean to insult; I read the article but I´m not american and the scientific language is sometimes complicated. I was just wondering why there is so much opposite information available

J

I'm not insulted lol, my point is it takes more than one read to grasp the science. I can't offer a sensible explanation about conflicting information. I'll just say gather the information for yourself  (like a meta analysis) and develop a working hypothesis....then field test it, in essence you yourself (ourselves) are our best advocates for real time results  (positive or negative growth). I've enclosed more information on GTE.

good luck on whatever you decide.

L.

I think we have an answer, Green Tea Extract- GTE inhibits prostate cancer by reducing the cell growth and blocks the androgen receptor. Green tea extract need to be @ 60-80% in EGCG polyphenols though. The dosage needs to be determined, recommend use is 2-3 capsules per day, I'm thinking it's slightly more (4-5?) from what this study says. Would this elimante the need for other anti-androgens?, possibly. Soooo- I see a good plan as follows: (though, it's up to you, it won't hurt my feelings).

1-pro-estrogen source
1-pro-aromatase
Green tea extract (imo 4-5 caps per day)
1-growth hormone source
Add the standard healthy fats, exercise, massage, pumping, etc.

 Epigallocatechin-3-gallate EGCG, the major polyphenolic constituent present in green tea, imparts antiproliferative effects against both androgen-sensitive and androgen-insensitive human PCA cells, and this effect is mediated by deregulation in cell cycle and induction of apoptosis. GTE is potent inhibitors of type 1 but not type 2 5α-reductase. (−)Epigallocatechin-3-gallate also inhibits accessory sex gland growth in the rat. These results suggest that certain tea gallates can regulate androgen action in target organs.

EGCG (green tea) acts as an antagonist of androgen function, similar to the pharmacological inhibitor Casodex, which was used as a control.

So what does this mean?,........it means green tea acts like a pro-pharma class of anti-androgens named Casodex, as in brand name Bicalutamide-aka, a pure antiandrogen used in the treatment of prostate cancer:

Bicalutamide
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Casodex

Green tea polyphenol EGCG blunts androgen receptor function in prostate cancer
The present study is one of the first few reports demonstrating the antiandrogenic action of a plant product and the first report showing the effect of EGCG, a naturally occurring polyphenol present in green tea, in inhibiting human prostate carcinoma cell growth. We have shown that EGCG effectively inhibits the transactivation functions and expression of AR by interfering with its stability as a result of decreased interdomain interaction (Fig. 5). We also showed that EGCG is a novel antagonisAR signaling, which can block AR-regulated gene expression and cell growth in human PCa cells. We thus suggest that EGCG could be developed as a chemotherapeutic agent against hormone-refractory PCa.
 
http://www.fasebj.org/content/25/4/1198.full

Lotus -

What green tea extract do yourecommend.  To date, I've been relying on a couple of cups of brewed tea per day but cannot tell if it has any effect.

Also, what is a "pro-hormone?"  I think I have the other bases covered, which leaves me perpetually at second base.

spanky

Hi spanky,

I don't have a brand yet, but it's going to be more like 8-12 cups per day according to the research (see below). However, the bio-availability of GTE is long: 1 μg/mL inhibits cancer cell growth for 96 hours. Given enough time (lol) I'll find that GTE is an CYP 17 inhibitor, if it isn't, it should be. I'd go for GTE in pill form, I don't think I could do 8-12 cups. Maybe a combination of liquids/capsules.

Anyways, we'd be looking for a GTE @ 80% polyphenols.....,I've seen them out there, I'm guessing $20-30?.....the cost savings?, priceless in my mind, in other words GTE benefits reaches far beyond our purpose for NBE. (See study below)

Epigallocatechin 3-Gallate and Green Tea Catechins: United They Work, Divided They Fail
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles...175934.pdf