(19-09-2015, 11:34 PM)CalmlyAndrogynous Wrote: Believe it or not there is Japanese manga that covers this (and quite a long running series) and I think written by an intersex person. (IS: Otoko Demo Onna Demo Nai Sei)
The point of view of the protagonist (in the 3rd and longest story) in the manga is that they are who they are, something of both. Their parents shielded them from the Drs who tried to force an early decision.
The catch is though, that unless you want a short life span, you have to make a decision at some point. Assuming this was not just a plot device, having low T and E is not a good thing long term.
I personally think this Dr is way off, too absorbed in their own god complex maybe.
I'll look up that Manga, haven't heard of that one before.
Quite possible it is the ego/complex thing, I was mostly trying to figure out just how he arrived at the conclusion that not doing unnecessary cosmetic surgery on a child is Unethical.
(20-09-2015, 01:19 AM)flamesabers Wrote: To play devil's advocate, I think this is a type of situation in which there are very few good outcomes and too many bad outcomes. Playing the role of god and doing surgery to assign a sex is certainly unethical, just as I think it would be unethical for parents to engage in genetic engineering to select particular physical traits. However, even if there are no medical ramifications of allowing intersex children to stay as they are, there is still the dilemma of how to raise such children in society. Unless intersex children are raised in isolation, sooner or later they will realize they are very different from virtually everyone else. I think such a realization would be overwhelming for most adults, let alone children. And this would probably happen at an age where children tease each other over insignificant things like wearing glasses, having freckles or being tall. Besides the plight of being an outcast amongst peers, I suspect most adults (even well-meaning adults) would have trouble grappling with the prospect of addressing and interacting with children that defy the sex dichotomy. Public bathrooms are segregated by sex. Most forms requesting you to specify your biological sex only has 2 options. Even the English language has no official pronouns to address intersex individuals.
while that makes a bit of sense from a certain point of view, a doctor specializing in the field should (at least you would think they would be) aware of a number of facts that have been proven multiple times.
one primary one being that they only get the forced surgical assignment right about 15% of the time.
(20-09-2015, 01:19 AM)flamesabers Wrote: At best intersex children grow up to be functional and happy adults who may choose to have surgery to have the genitals of only one sex. At worst intersex children may resort to suicide due to the unending extreme emotions of isolation and alienation from the rest of society. I imagine all decent and loving parents would never want to play god and make such a decision about what sex to alter their child to be. However, the same type of parents wouldn't want to risk putting their child through the hell of alienation and isolation of not fully belonging to either half of the species.
in a perfect world where 80-90+% of the surgical assignments are right & done right that works, but when it's 15% no, I don't agree with that.
(20-09-2015, 01:19 AM)flamesabers Wrote: I am reminded of a story I saw on television a long time ago. A mother of three young children is pregnant and will soon give birth to a fourth child. However, she has a serious health condition that must be operated on before she gives birth or she will die. If she undergoes the operation, the unborn child will suffer severe brain damage. Her options therefore are:
a. Forego the operation, deliver a healthy child and die soon after.
b. Get the operation and give birth to a child with severe brain damage.
c. Get the operation and get an abortion.
I didn't see how the story ended, but it seemed she wanted to go with option A. My mother who was watching the show with me, commented 'what about her three young children? Protecting the life and health of her fourth child means condemning her other three children to a life without their mother.' Her husband and three children don't want her to die. She is willing to sacrifice herself if the only alternatives are to maim or kill her fourth child. While it may be possible to argue one option is more ethical than the others, any of the options would require a combination of the death, physical maiming or emotional scarring of one or more individuals.
Considering the Surgery is not correcting something that is a threat to the child's health and is only correcting a cosmetic issue that is not visible to everyone else (unless they are in a nudist colony), that doesn't apply imho.
examples:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=trmbnnQTgp4
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cr96b9v1YB8
just found this one:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p8id0IzR0Io
[edit]Stumbled across this one just now, Very Well Done but a lot longer than the others[/edit]
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4bnWNbCJmUM

