[rachel-rache]

I'm strongly considering trying PM (already have it in my amazon cart ) for the mental changes as well as the the physical. However, I do not know if these mental changes may end up being more favorable or not. In case they are not, how permanent will the changes be? Has anyone taken them for a short or prolonged period and then stopped their program altogether and noticed themselves for the most part back to their pre NBE mentality?

I've been having a lot of mostly social but also general anxiety since around my puberty years; I read in the description of others about how estrogens have made them be able to express their feelings better. I feel like that's exactly what I need to diffuse the debilitating stress I often feel and will be an elegant solution-- consistent with how my moderately GD mind may be geared for higher levels of E to T ratios. Of course that's an ideal case and there's a good chance that may not be the case, so I want to know that changes are reversible to not risk being in a worse place than before.

Anyone have any thoughts?

[flamesabers]

Hello bobowo.

I think the answer to your question varies, depending on whether you're looking at this from a philosophical view versus a physical/psychological perspective. When you have GD, I think there's a reasonable chance that any mental changes brought about by pm will be favorable rather than negative. If you only do take pm for a short time, I suspect the changes (if any) will be temporary and not permanent. However, the experience of taking pm (and changing your estrogen/testosterone balance) may alter your perspective on your GD and gender identity completely.

Hypothetically, depending on the circumstances of your GD, pm may open a can of worms you're not prepared for. For some, taking pm may be a revelation of how much happier they are when taking estrogen and go on to realize that transitioning is in their best interests as far as their well-being goes.

[Samantha Rogers]

Well put, Flame, but I would add one caveat...just a pet peave of mine really. Once you begin adding herbal or chemical supps to alter your hormonal system you are in fact "transitioning". I think what you meant was that some members have gone on the full transition in the form of moving to a 24/7 female experience and possible SRS. There is a great deal of ambiguity in how people throw the word "transitioning" around. Though at one time, it was certainly accurate to use the word exclusively to describe those on a course to SRS, that is no longer the case by any means. Many remain on some form of HRT or another forever, without "going all the way". But from the first supp taken, we are all "transitioning" in one form or another.
I understood what you meant, but I just wanted to clarify that, as it sometimes causes confusion.
Hugs

[flamesabers]

Well put, Flame, but I would add one caveat...just a pet peave of mine really. Once you begin adding herbal or chemical supps to alter your hormonal system you are in fact "transitioning". I think what you meant was that some members have gone on the full transition in the form of moving to a 24/7 female experience and possible SRS. There is a great deal of ambiguity in how people throw the word "transitioning" around. Though at one time, it was certainly accurate to use the word exclusively to describe those on a course to SRS, that is no longer the case by any means. Many remain on some form of HRT or another forever, without "going all the way". But from the first supp taken, we are all "transitioning" in one form or another.
I understood what you meant, but I just wanted to clarify that, as it sometimes causes confusion.
Hugs

Samantha, I agree that NBE can be considered a form of partial transition. However, I would prefer not to overuse the word "transitioning" to the extent that its original definition is ignored or forgotten.

[Samantha Rogers]

Well, Flame, thats the problem with terms, in that language evolves. English is a living language in that it is constantly changing through common usage, unlike French where they are very particular about changes. My point is that the nature of the term has changed. There was a time not too very long past, when the only way to gain official apprival for hormone use was by first demostrating committment to full transition and spending a full year living 24/7 en femme. And the administration of homone therapy was seen officially as a step toward SRS exclusively. This was madness of course. Many were hurt by this close minded approach. But in that context, using the term "transitioning" to refer to the process made sense, because HRT was always a transition to female. Now, however, it has been recognised by most in the professional fields and elsewhere that for many HRT is not a transitional phase but for many an end unto itself. However, on this board and most all other TG boards I have seen, "transitioning" is now thrown around by different people each meaning something different. Some refer to it as meaning the path to SRS but others do not. My point is that once you begin changing your hormonal balance, whether by pharma HRT, or by herbal HRT, you are in essence changing, or "transitiining" from one state to another.
I just like to keep terminology honest.

[Marina Kits]

In addition to being transgender, I must have some French in me as well. I prefer to define transitioning as doing some or all of the following: breast augmentation or reduction, SRS, complete overhaul of the wardrobe and coming out to family and friends. Anything short of that should (in my opinion) have a term of it's own so there's no confusion about what a person is doing. And just to go a little further, I'd say that NBE is a form of HRT but HRT is not synonymous with NBE. HRT (in my personal dictionary) implies consuming pharmaceutical's made in laboratories while NBE would include dietary supplements found in nature without extensive alterations or purification's. ...This all, purely my own unsolicited thoughts on the matter... Take it or leave it at will.

To answer to OP, I don't think you'll permanently alter your body chemistry no matter how long you take PM but it might change your mind about yourself or give you a different perspective on the world as it has certainly done for me.

[Eloise]

If there's one certitude of PM usage, it's that the effects, both mental and physical, differ person-to-person. Some people here have reported no mental effects while having all the physical effects; some reported mental effects before having any physical effects; and some even reported no mental or physical effects. There's only one way to really find out how PM will work on you: you have to take it. But you shouldn't take PM lightly. It's more than just popping some caps.

Which brings me to the point: It would seem that since PM is a phytoestrogen (that is, it mimics estrogen (E2)), its mental effects should only happen when you take PM. Once you stop PM, any PM-induced mental effects should stop. The physical effects (ie, boobs), however, are a bit more permanent. (This is a question best answered by Lotus.)

I'm not a doctor, so I can't give you a fool-proof 100% answer.

[rachel-rache]

blahh... i want to take PM SO badly, but I can't risk my fertility on it or I'd have the rest of my life pinching myself. It's just that I feel like as every day passes I'm getting older and the potential decreases. I can't stop thinking about this. However, in a way this has me feeling like a raging bull, very focused to getting to where I need to be and mowing down any obstacle in my path. In a way this feeling is great because I feel this insurmountable amount of energy to achieve remarkable things in my career, day-to-day tasks, and relationships, all knowing it is getting me closer to the at least partial HRT I want.

[flamesabers]

In addition to being transgender, I must have some French in me as well.

Maybe my mind is just tired or whatever, but when I first scanned this sentence, the thought of "French Maid" surfaced.

blahh... i want to take PM SO badly, but I can't risk my fertility on it or I'd have the rest of my life pinching myself. It's just that I feel like as every day passes I'm getting older and the potential decreases. I can't stop thinking about this. However, in a way this has me feeling like a raging bull, very focused to getting to where I need to be and mowing down any obstacle in my path. In a way this feeling is great because I feel this insurmountable amount of energy to achieve remarkable things in my career, day-to-day tasks, and relationships, all knowing it is getting me closer to the at least partial HRT I want.

bobowo,

Please don't try to burn yourself out by relentlessly pushing yourself to do things you aren't yet ready to do or have thought through fully. I think to have GD and also want to have kids is a tragic irony, just as having GD and being married to a spouse who loves you as a man.

[GoneGirl]

Well put, Flame, but I would add one caveat...just a pet peave of mine really. Once you begin adding herbal or chemical supps to alter your hormonal system you are in fact "transitioning". I think what you meant was that some members have gone on the full transition in the form of moving to a 24/7 female experience and possible SRS. There is a great deal of ambiguity in how people throw the word "transitioning" around. Though at one time, it was certainly accurate to use the word exclusively to describe those on a course to SRS, that is no longer the case by any means. Many remain on some form of HRT or another forever, without "going all the way". But from the first supp taken, we are all "transitioning" in one form or another.
I understood what you meant, but I just wanted to clarify that, as it sometimes causes confusion.
Hugs

I think that by using the word 'transitioning' there is an implication that the final destination is living and presenting as the opposite sex full-time, i.e. as a transsexual. I don't like that implication, because many of us transgendered are not sure how far we are going. I consider myself to be 'transitioning' to a female gender expression to some degree, that is still up in the air. In the beginning, I didn't expect to go as far as I have to date, and I know that I am going further still. How far? I don't know, but I don't know how to describe the process any other way. When one alters their sexual hormone balance to affect feminization with the development of breasts, a more feminine shape, facial and body hair removal, etc., that is transitioning in my book even if the process stops short of SRS or life as a transsexual.

Having said that, I'm not against adopting less ambiguous terminology, so if the word 'transitioning' causes too much confusion, what word should be used instead? Partial transitioning? Crossgendering?

Clara