[bryony]

Bryony,

No, my cold turkey experiment has nothing to do with reproduction. I don't want to have kids, my two cats are enough for me.

Yes, it's about trying to get back in shape.

Ok, in that case, is your main energy source fat or carbs? Recent studies imply that runners actually do better on a ketogenic diet. Let me know if you want any links.

B.

[Mindy2017]

Flame,

Right with you on the get back in shape. After five and a half months switching from BO then to PM on a constant cycle noticed a little much wight gain for my liking. One week off now but no loss in the realm of itching, growth feelings etc... Going to stay off two more. More time on the bike will work off some of the gains, and who knows maybe the break will recharge receptors and a new growth spurt will kick back in. With 3 weeks off I would have to think any accumulation would work out of the system. Time will tell.

[bryony]

Flame,

Right with you on the get back in shape. After five and a half months switching from BO then to PM on a constant cycle noticed a little much wight gain for my liking. One week off now but no loss in the realm of itching, growth feelings etc... Going to stay off two more. More time on the bike will work off some of the gains, and who knows maybe the break will recharge receptors and a new growth spurt will kick back in. With 3 weeks off I would have to think any accumulation would work out of the system. Time will tell.

I think we need to start a nutrition thread. What needs to be understood is that if one changes one's hormonal balance to that of a female, one has to eat like a female. Estrogen makes your body want to put on fat on the hips, buttocks, and breasts, but it does not do anything about the fat in the male areas that you already have.

Muscle loss will occur because males have a hell of a lot of muscle without working for it. Under the influence of testosterone, it just grows, but PM suppresses testosterone. There are muscular women around, but they have to work really hard at it.

One thing needs to be understood. Most people, as they get older develop a disorder whereby their insulin production gets out of whack, and they start producing too much when they eat carbs. During my lifetime, it has become an accepted creed that older people get fatter. It just ain't true, unless those old people get most of their energy from carbs.

Most older people eat their carbs, produce a huge insulin spike, mop up all the blood glucose, convert it to fat and still feel hungry because they cannot get at most of the energy they have just consumed.

If you want to lose weight, and do endurance training, then your best bet is to become fat-adapted, so that you burn ketone bodies instead of glucose.

I recommend anyone with weight and fitness issues to invest 15 minutes of their time with the video and text here.

B.

[flamesabers]

I've gone cold turkey from pm for about a solid two months now. Perhaps the most noteworthy change during this period is the envy/admiration I sometimes experience when looking at some females, not the women in fashion magazines, but females you would see on an everyday basis. It's also becoming more abundantly clear as to why my gender identity lies in the realm of obscurity or andrygnony. As much as I have a soft spot for things that would be considered feminine, I also have a rather detached, realist and sometimes harsh perspective on life.

I hope I'm making some sense here.

[Sofia Bunny]

I've gone cold turkey from pm for about a solid two months now. Perhaps the most noteworthy change during this period is the envy/admiration I sometimes experience when looking at some females, not the women in fashion magazines, but females you would see on an everyday basis. It's also becoming more abundantly clear as to why my gender identity lies in the realm of obscurity or andrygnony. As much as I have a soft spot for things that would be considered feminine, I also have a rather detached, realist and sometimes harsh perspective on life.

I hope I'm making some sense here.

So perhaps I'm misunderstanding but it almost sounds like there is some part of you that would like to be a woman if maybe you were more passable. Now of course I could have missed my mark by a long shot.

Could it also be in some part of our human nature that envies what we do not have? You know like that saying the grass always seems greener on the other side?

Well that's my understanding of your findings.

[bryony]

I've gone cold turkey from pm for about a solid two months now. Perhaps the most noteworthy change during this period is the envy/admiration I sometimes experience when looking at some females, not the women in fashion magazines, but females you would see on an everyday basis.

All of them? Attractive, plain, young, old, slim, fat?

I'm guessing ordinary, young, pleasingly attractive in face and form? If so, then yeah, I still have that envy, though thankfully not the compulsions that go with it.

It's also becoming more abundantly clear as to why my gender identity lies in the realm of obscurity or andrygnony. As much as I have a soft spot for things that would be considered feminine, I also have a rather detached, realist and sometimes harsh perspective on life.

I hope I'm making some sense here.

It's definitely how I feel... which is odd, because I'm not doing cold turkey any more! Think how bad I used to be!

Much as I admire the FFS that some members undergo, and I had the money and was free to pursue it, the rest of me would never look right.

I look in the mirror and see how wrong the width and depth of my rib cage looks.
If the diameter of my ribcage were not 34" but 30" the breasts that I have grown would look spectacular. Shoulders loom out above them, and despite getting hip fat, the dents where my narrow iliac crest are look wrong too.

As my own worst critic, I can just imagine looking at my nude reflection with a female face on the wrong shaped body and agonising over the imperfections.

I'd rather be grumpy about what I can't have than try and fail to obtain it.

(Some people are glass-half-full, some are glass-half-empty... but what if you wanted a cheeseburger?)

B.

[flamesabers]

Fire,

I think it's more about wanting to move closer to the androgynous zone in a physical sense than wanting to transition to the opposite sex. My aim is to obscure the physical clues of my sex rather than undergo a total metamorphosis if that makes sense.

Yes, I agree the grass is greener on the other side.

Bryony,

Yeah, you got me. My admiration is directed towards ordinary, young, pleasingly attractive in face and form. It's interesting to hear you have had the same experience. Is an androgynous thing or something else do you think?

[bryony]

Bryony,

Yeah, you got me. My admiration is directed towards ordinary, young, pleasingly attractive in face and form. It's interesting to hear you have had the same experience. Is an androgynous thing or something else do you think?

Well, what you call androgynous is what I consider to be a point on the spectrum of mail brain development which goes from comfortable with gender identity / heterosexual to extreme G.D. / homosexual (w.r.t. birth sex).

So at the one end, you have what I annoyingly call a "normal male", and at the other end what I irritatingly refer to as a "classic transsexual".

If you take normal male on the far left and classic transsexual on the far right, I would put you and me to the left of centre and and mid-life-late-transitioner/"lesbian transsexual" to the right of centre.

I dont want to try to pretend, however successfully (or not - mostly not) that I am a woman, I want to have been born one. Therein lies the dysphoria.

Still, I'm very happy with my boobs. Clearly the mutation that removed the pleasurable aspect from some women for having them fondled did not enter my bloodline. (Ironically, my wife does have the mutation, and never cared for breast fondling. Crazy, eh?)

They truly are an awesome alternative to the genitalia as sources of pleasure. I can honestly say that my male parts never gave me such intense pleasure or for as long a duration as they do.

So, androgyny definitely works for me!

B.

[flamesabers]

If you take normal male on the far left and classic transsexual on the far right, I would put you and me to the left of centre and and mid-life-late-transitioner/"lesbian transsexual" to the right of centre.

How would you classify those in left-center of this spectrum?

I dont want to try to pretend, however successfully (or not - mostly not) that I am a woman, I want to have been born one. Therein lies the dysphoria.

Even though I agree we fall in the same area of the gender identity spectrum, I think our ulterior motives for pursuing NBE but still presenting as male is very different. I think it's simply in my nature to test and blur gender boundaries and expectations regardless of what my bio-sex is.

[GoneGirl]

I dont want to try to pretend, however successfully (or not - mostly not) that I am a woman, I want to have been born one. Therein lies the dysphoria.

I now see how we are fundamentally different, Bryony. I don't want to pretend, however successfully, that I am a man, despite having been born one (male sex organs). Therein lies my dysphoria.

Clara