24-03-2015, 02:40 AM
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24-03-2015, 05:32 AM
@ Lotus....
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24-03-2015, 08:14 AM
Hello (= hope all are doing well!!!
I have a question for you, Lotus =D hope you're available =]]
I remember months ago you recommending to take evening primrose oil as an aromatase and pumpkin seed oil as an anti-androgen (both in the capsule form).
i have been taking them religiously as recommended, sometimes upping the doses, sometimes lowering them. I'm wondering, should I take time off and stop them all together? I'm on my PM break for maybe another month or 2 btw. are these supplements any different from taking say a multi vitamin or biotin, etc. do you have to stop taking them from time to time?
Right now i'm taking: multivitamin, Evening P.O., Pumpkin S.O., biotin, magnesium, B-complex. Do you recommend I stop any or keep everything going? (minus the PM, i know you need breaks with that one, which i'm one)
i know ur not a Dr or anything, but i feel u give the most soundest and clearest and most helpful advise tbh! hope you can help!!! Much love!!
Good luck to you on your progress xoxo
I have a question for you, Lotus =D hope you're available =]]
I remember months ago you recommending to take evening primrose oil as an aromatase and pumpkin seed oil as an anti-androgen (both in the capsule form).
i have been taking them religiously as recommended, sometimes upping the doses, sometimes lowering them. I'm wondering, should I take time off and stop them all together? I'm on my PM break for maybe another month or 2 btw. are these supplements any different from taking say a multi vitamin or biotin, etc. do you have to stop taking them from time to time?
Right now i'm taking: multivitamin, Evening P.O., Pumpkin S.O., biotin, magnesium, B-complex. Do you recommend I stop any or keep everything going? (minus the PM, i know you need breaks with that one, which i'm one)
i know ur not a Dr or anything, but i feel u give the most soundest and clearest and most helpful advise tbh! hope you can help!!! Much love!!
Good luck to you on your progress xoxo
Hi , I'm new to this so bear with me....
I just want some advice as there is so many conflicting opinions my head is frazzled.
I started taking pm on the first day of cycle last month and took it for 15 days. 1000mg a day (Although I had been taking 500 a day a fortnight prior to starting my period to get my body used to it)
I was clearly taking to much as had blurred vision, lighthead and palpitations.
I stopped after 15 days however my period is now 4 days late...
Am I best to continue like I was on the first day of my next period or change it to what others have suggested and start taking it after my period for 15 days??
I am scared to say this as I have seen some people getting g slack for it but yup it's ainterol pure d 500 that I took! Don't judge me. Haha.
This was the 3rd batch I bought after buying 2 others which were not pure.
What is everyone else's opinion on when I should restart the pm.
I am 35 and just want fullness in my bust as after having my daughter and coming of the pill which I had been on for 17 years the lack of oestrogen in my body has seen my chest deflate and flop greatly which is causing me great distress and loads of paranoia issues...
Any nice advice would be great
xx
I just want some advice as there is so many conflicting opinions my head is frazzled.
I started taking pm on the first day of cycle last month and took it for 15 days. 1000mg a day (Although I had been taking 500 a day a fortnight prior to starting my period to get my body used to it)
I was clearly taking to much as had blurred vision, lighthead and palpitations.
I stopped after 15 days however my period is now 4 days late...
Am I best to continue like I was on the first day of my next period or change it to what others have suggested and start taking it after my period for 15 days??
I am scared to say this as I have seen some people getting g slack for it but yup it's ainterol pure d 500 that I took! Don't judge me. Haha.
This was the 3rd batch I bought after buying 2 others which were not pure.
What is everyone else's opinion on when I should restart the pm.
I am 35 and just want fullness in my bust as after having my daughter and coming of the pill which I had been on for 17 years the lack of oestrogen in my body has seen my chest deflate and flop greatly which is causing me great distress and loads of paranoia issues...
Any nice advice would be great
xx
24-03-2015, 05:55 PM
(24-03-2015, 08:14 AM)34TripleD Wrote: Hello (= hope all are doing well!!!
I have a question for you, Lotus =D hope you're available =]]
I remember months ago you recommending to take evening primrose oil as an aromatase and pumpkin seed oil as an anti-androgen (both in the capsule form).
i have been taking them religiously as recommended, sometimes upping the doses, sometimes lowering them. I'm wondering, should I take time off and stop them all together? I'm on my PM break for maybe another month or 2 btw. are these supplements any different from taking say a multi vitamin or biotin, etc. do you have to stop taking them from time to time?
Right now i'm taking: multivitamin, Evening P.O., Pumpkin S.O., biotin, magnesium, B-complex. Do you recommend I stop any or keep everything going? (minus the PM, i know you need breaks with that one, which i'm one)
i know ur not a Dr or anything, but i feel u give the most soundest and clearest and most helpful advise tbh! hope you can help!!! Much love!!
Good luck to you on your progress xoxo
Hi 34,
EPO should've given you swelling, help elimate DHT and help synthesize aromatase. Biotin will also help with FAS (fatty acid synthase). Omega 3's will help reduce inflammation, if you've got too much omega 6's you'll see (or get) unnecessary inflammatory response. Too much PGE2 (prostaglandin) in response from inflammation pushes this response ratio, in other words.....stop growth potential.
Imo balance the omegas, (stop the EPO for 2 weeks) add in omega 3 (chia seeds) 2-3 grams daily. After 2 weeks add coconut oil, 1-2 tablespoons daily. Drop the PSO, there's enough 5 ar inhibitor in EPO once you add it back.
I think you have the right components, it's just missing a few essentials, (e.g. growth hormone). Here's what I mean:
Effects of growth hormone on adipose tissue.
Abstract
Physiological effects of growth hormone (GH) extend beyond the stimulation of linear growth. These include important metabolic effects upon adipose tissue. GH affects both proliferation and differentiation of preadipocytes, although this varies between clonal cell lines and preadipocyte cultures. Both preadipocytes and mature adipocytes possess specific GH receptors. GH may mediate its actions via these receptors, but some effects are indirectly mediated through the GH-mediated secretion of insulin-like growth factor-I (IGF-I) within adipose tissue. GH promotes lipolysis via inhibition of lipoprotein lipase, which hydrolyzes triglycerides in the circulation to make them available for triglyceride accumulation in adipose tissue. GH also stimulates hormone sensitive lipase (HSL), the rate-limiting step for release of stored triglyceride in adipocytes (lipolysis). As GH becomes utilized for various "non-growth" concerns (see Figure 1), awareness of the metabolic effects on adipocytes is important to understand the clinical effects seen with GH therapy.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/11086655
_______________________
This website below gives an excellent summary on how to go about proceeding:
Stimulating the Body’s Production of Human Growth Hormone
http://www.bodybuildingforyou.com/articl...uction.htm
I'll post other info on inducible nitric oxide synthase, and how it modulates lipolysis in adipocytes (The basis for building breast tissue), really interesting stuff.
------------------------
iaboy and gamer, what's (a) the simple explanation of inactivating DHT?, (i dunno) picture a free loading uncle named DHT, hey lol, work with me!
.....all he does is sponge off you...eats you out of house and home.......solution.....drop kick his ass to the curb while he's sleeping...(oh yeah!!, you forgot to tell him it's also trash day). Now he's......I-N-A-C-T-I-V-E (sorry, it's the best I got today).
24-03-2015, 05:59 PM
I understand what inactivate means, but I am no chemist. Which, if any, herb or supplement will do this w/out running serious risk?
24-03-2015, 06:20 PM
(24-03-2015, 05:55 PM)Lotus Wrote: Hi 34,
EPO should've given you swelling, help elimate DHT and help synthesize aromatase. Biotin will also help with FAS (fatty acid synthase). Omega 3's will help reduce inflammation, if you've got too much omega 6's you'll see (or get) unnecessary inflammatory response. Too much PGE2 (prostaglandin) in response from inflammation pushes this response ratio, in other words.....stop growth potential.
Imo balance the omegas, (stop the EPO for 2 weeks) add in omega 3 (chia seeds) 2-3 grams daily. After 2 weeks add coconut oil, 1-2 tablespoons daily. Drop the PSO, there's enough 5 ar inhibitor in EPO once you add it back.
I think you have the right components, it's just missing a few essentials, (e.g. growth hormone). Here's what I mean:
Effects of growth hormone on adipose tissue.
Abstract
Physiological effects of growth hormone (GH) extend beyond the stimulation of linear growth. These include important metabolic effects upon adipose tissue. GH affects both proliferation and differentiation of preadipocytes, although this varies between clonal cell lines and preadipocyte cultures. Both preadipocytes and mature adipocytes possess specific GH receptors. GH may mediate its actions via these receptors, but some effects are indirectly mediated through the GH-mediated secretion of insulin-like growth factor-I (IGF-I) within adipose tissue. GH promotes lipolysis via inhibition of lipoprotein lipase, which hydrolyzes triglycerides in the circulation to make them available for triglyceride accumulation in adipose tissue. GH also stimulates hormone sensitive lipase (HSL), the rate-limiting step for release of stored triglyceride in adipocytes (lipolysis). As GH becomes utilized for various "non-growth" concerns (see Figure 1), awareness of the metabolic effects on adipocytes is important to understand the clinical effects seen with GH therapy.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/11086655
_______________________
This website below gives an excellent summary on how to go about proceeding:
Stimulating the Body’s Production of Human Growth Hormone
http://www.bodybuildingforyou.com/articl...uction.htm
I'll post other info on inducible nitric oxide synthase, and how it modulates lipolysis in adipocytes (The basis for building breast tissue), really interesting stuff.
------------------------
iaboy and gamer, what's (a) the simple explanation of inactivating DHT?, (i dunno) picture a free loading uncle named DHT, hey lol, work with me!
Now he's......I-N-A-C-T-I-V-E (sorry, it's the best I got today).
Thank you oh so very much for responding Lotus!!!!! xoxox
I will stop the PSO altogether, and go on a break w/ EPO, and switch over to chia seeds & coconut oil like you said!!
I do work out on a consistent basis, get my veggies and sleep like that article said for the Growth Hormone....not sure if there is a vitamin/supplement that will help.... i'll just start PM again in a couple of months ..seems like the best GH lol (=
thanks again!!! <3
24-03-2015, 11:15 PM
Hi Lotus, here I am 
This is another paper about palmitoylation:
Palmitoylation regulates 17β-estradiol-induced estrogen receptor-α degradation and transcriptional activity.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/22446104
[...]
The lack of palmitoylation renders ERα more susceptible to E2-dependent degradation, blocks ERα S118 phosphorylation and prevents E2-induced ERα estrogen-responsive element-containing promoter occupancy. Consequently, ERα transcriptional activity is prevented and the receptor addressed to the nuclear matrix subnuclear compartment. These data uncover a circuitry in which receptor palmitoylation links E2-dependent ERα degradation, S118 phosphorylation, and transcriptional activity in a unique molecular mechanism. We propose that rapid E2-dependent signaling could be considered as a prerequisite for ERα transcriptional activity and suggest an integrated model of ERα intracellular signaling where E2-dependent early extranuclear effects control late receptor-dependent nuclear actions.
ok palmitoylation is good for a good estrogen activity, you ask: "the palmitoylation of estrogen receptor alpha (ER-a) is (or can be) mediated by oxidative phosphorylation?"
my answer is: I don't know...what do you mean?
Oxidative phosphorylation, wiki (not my favourite source, but this time i can use it):
Oxidative phosphorylation (or OXPHOS in short) is the metabolic pathway in which the mitochondria in cells use their structure, enzymes, and energy released by the oxidation of nutrients to reform ATP. Although the many forms of life on earth use a range of different nutrients, ATP is the molecule that supplies energy to metabolism. Almost all aerobic organisms carry out oxidative phosphorylation.[...]. Although oxidative phosphorylation is a vital part of metabolism, it produces reactive oxygen species such as superoxide and hydrogen peroxide, which lead to propagation of free radicals, damaging cells and contributing to disease and, possibly, aging (senescence). The enzymes carrying out this metabolic pathway are also the target of many drugs and poisons that inhibit their activities.
in the paper above, it says: These E2 rapid effects require a population of the ERα located at the cell plasma membrane through palmitoylation, a dynamic enzymatic modification mediated by palmitoyl-acyl-transferases.
We should find how this enzyme palmitoyl-acyl-transferases works, if you want to gain estrogen activity (and maybe is not enough, as you see our bodies are quite complicated... )
indeed from your link: "E2 reduces both ERalpha palmitoylation and its interaction with caveolin-1, in a time- and dose-dependent manner"
So, if you want you can increase estrogen receptor expression, but there is a negative feedback as well from estradiol. This is good for the body, to regulate his pathways....and try to keep some equilibrium. We just want to move some of it to favor breast growth, and if estrogen receptor is stronger than negative feedback of estradiol, than it should be worthy the way of palmitoylation.
I think the best way to try to gain some breast is in my previous link, and you noticed that: we should just low the androgen activity in breast, to have breast growth. This is quite simpler than taking account of all the other biological pathways, that's why i started from that (anyway, everything is important, also estrogen, and food, and enzymes.... but i think that the king to fight here is DHT)
I didn't know about DHT metabolites, my thoughs are: if DHT (and metabolite) is more androgenic, then estrogenic in breast tissue, than it could be helpful low it.
ehm... nope. I'm just a scientist, not omniscient :-P
i didn't find this before. I read something on your A.A. thread, but now i missed it. Could you link some source? I tried to have a look but i couldn't find much.
Then i will tell you what I think, but for sure, if fatty acids can promote aromatase expression, that would be great!
Where did you see that? which paper? i quickly had a look on the one you linked before, but i didn't find that information
eheh, i'm glad as well, but there is other people that contributed sometimes. Anyway I understand the way you feel. I'm crazy almost like you, and i like scientific research, so I can make good company (Imao)
Your knowledge is becoming huge, also you research a lot, so there is no big difference between you and a scientist. You could apply to a University if you wanted.
Finally, could you help me? I'm looking information for "bad estrogen" that make growth faster,
what is its name? I saw it somewhere but I don't remember.
Thank you very much
See you,
bye!
This is another paper about palmitoylation:
Palmitoylation regulates 17β-estradiol-induced estrogen receptor-α degradation and transcriptional activity.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/22446104
[...]
The lack of palmitoylation renders ERα more susceptible to E2-dependent degradation, blocks ERα S118 phosphorylation and prevents E2-induced ERα estrogen-responsive element-containing promoter occupancy. Consequently, ERα transcriptional activity is prevented and the receptor addressed to the nuclear matrix subnuclear compartment. These data uncover a circuitry in which receptor palmitoylation links E2-dependent ERα degradation, S118 phosphorylation, and transcriptional activity in a unique molecular mechanism. We propose that rapid E2-dependent signaling could be considered as a prerequisite for ERα transcriptional activity and suggest an integrated model of ERα intracellular signaling where E2-dependent early extranuclear effects control late receptor-dependent nuclear actions.
ok palmitoylation is good for a good estrogen activity, you ask: "the palmitoylation of estrogen receptor alpha (ER-a) is (or can be) mediated by oxidative phosphorylation?"
my answer is: I don't know...what do you mean?
Oxidative phosphorylation, wiki (not my favourite source, but this time i can use it):
Oxidative phosphorylation (or OXPHOS in short) is the metabolic pathway in which the mitochondria in cells use their structure, enzymes, and energy released by the oxidation of nutrients to reform ATP. Although the many forms of life on earth use a range of different nutrients, ATP is the molecule that supplies energy to metabolism. Almost all aerobic organisms carry out oxidative phosphorylation.[...]. Although oxidative phosphorylation is a vital part of metabolism, it produces reactive oxygen species such as superoxide and hydrogen peroxide, which lead to propagation of free radicals, damaging cells and contributing to disease and, possibly, aging (senescence). The enzymes carrying out this metabolic pathway are also the target of many drugs and poisons that inhibit their activities.
in the paper above, it says: These E2 rapid effects require a population of the ERα located at the cell plasma membrane through palmitoylation, a dynamic enzymatic modification mediated by palmitoyl-acyl-transferases.
We should find how this enzyme palmitoyl-acyl-transferases works, if you want to gain estrogen activity (and maybe is not enough, as you see our bodies are quite complicated...
)indeed from your link: "E2 reduces both ERalpha palmitoylation and its interaction with caveolin-1, in a time- and dose-dependent manner"
So, if you want you can increase estrogen receptor expression, but there is a negative feedback as well from estradiol. This is good for the body, to regulate his pathways....and try to keep some equilibrium. We just want to move some of it to favor breast growth, and if estrogen receptor is stronger than negative feedback of estradiol, than it should be worthy the way of palmitoylation.
I think the best way to try to gain some breast is in my previous link, and you noticed that: we should just low the androgen activity in breast, to have breast growth. This is quite simpler than taking account of all the other biological pathways, that's why i started from that (anyway, everything is important, also estrogen, and food, and enzymes.... but i think that the king to fight here is DHT)
I didn't know about DHT metabolites, my thoughs are: if DHT (and metabolite) is more androgenic, then estrogenic in breast tissue, than it could be helpful low it.
Lotus Wrote:I'm sure you're aware that fatty acids synthesize aromatase, (what are your thoughts?)."
ehm... nope. I'm just a scientist, not omniscient :-P
i didn't find this before. I read something on your A.A. thread, but now i missed it. Could you link some source? I tried to have a look but i couldn't find much.
Then i will tell you what I think, but for sure, if fatty acids can promote aromatase expression, that would be great!
Lotus Wrote:"On another note....I've seen that EPA and DHA reduces the risk of breast cancer by as much as a 32% reduction, I don't know the dosage."
Where did you see that? which paper? i quickly had a look on the one you linked before, but i didn't find that information
-Clelia- Wrote:thank you Lotus, I'm ready to go. Happy me!no worries, of course not
yep you gave to a scientist a good homework
Lotus Wrote:Did i?..... cool, I thought I might have insulted you lol.
-Clelia- Wrote:How come, am I the only one? Where are all the others? There is a lot of people here.
Lotus Wrote:Don't know....but I'm glad you're here. I have all kinds of crazy ideas and only myself to entertain them, lmao."
eheh, i'm glad as well, but there is other people that contributed sometimes. Anyway I understand the way you feel. I'm crazy almost like you, and i like scientific research, so I can make good company (Imao)
-Clelia- Wrote:Anyway, you could be a scientist.
Lotus Wrote:You think so?, nah....... I'm not worthy although I'd love to be one. and thank you so much for saying so.
Your knowledge is becoming huge, also you research a lot, so there is no big difference between you and a scientist. You could apply to a University if you wanted.
Finally, could you help me? I'm looking information for "bad estrogen" that make growth faster,
what is its name? I saw it somewhere but I don't remember.
Thank you very much
See you,
bye!
24-03-2015, 11:35 PM
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