06-10-2015, 01:09 AM
Since I first stumbled upon BN I have been taking notes (and notes, and notes.....) and thought it was time to tidy them up. As I was going through them I wondered if others might benefit too? Especially if new to the world of NBE it can be a lot to take in before the understanding starts to sink in. Much of this was gleaned from BN and it is not a definitive "list of wisdom" by any means. But what I have mentioned here I can comment on from my own personal experience. If wiser heads than I notice I have said something incorrect, out of date, or worth adding, then please correct me. As if I have it wrong I am guessing others might have too? We are all learning here :-)
Won't bore you with my life history, but to give some context, I am in my 50's and slowly recovering from CFS, managing to whittle away at the weight I had gained and in remission from diabetes. So like many here, I do have health issues which affects what I chose to add or omit to my programme, which others may not. But I am not trying to make recommendations here anyway, just letting you all know what I am doing in the hope it may be of interest or help to somebody.
Current wisdom is to inhibit DHT and convert free testosterone to estradiol (estrogen) using a process called aromatase. And then supplement with an estrogen source which with DHT reduced can now work more effectively. But flooding the body with estrogen doesn't get you there any faster. Just enough is still enough. And testosterone isn't the poison, it's DHT, and without testosterone estrogen can't be made. DHT is the real enemy to stop breast growth. Inhibit DHT and breast growth will follow. However, a cautionary note. Bottoming out testosterone can bring on depression, weight gain and other health issues.
Scheduled breaks can be helpful. This can help take the load off the liver etc, and some have reported a jump in development after longer breaks. 5 days on and 2 days off seems to be a good option. Alternatively, taking 1 week out in 4. Milk Thistle is noted as being effective with cleansing the liver during the breaks.
Timing can influence effectiveness. Avoid taking around peak release times of DHT. Schedule for off peak times to administer supplements. Androgens (DHT) are highest at 8:00 am, with slight rises at noon, late afternoon and around 8:00 pm. So in other words, take at 10:00am, 2pm, 6pm and 10pm?
The current main weapons in our armoury are;
Red Reishi extract (LingZhi) - has an estrogenic action, is anti-inflammatory and very effective at blocking DHT (up to pharma levels). The health benefits of Reishi are too numerous to list! (seriously, it's a very long list) However, Reishi may lower blood pressure so caution needed. I prefer capsule form but be aware that Reishi extract is sold in different ratios. I have seen it available from 4-1 to 16-1 (the higher the more potent) so be aware of what you are buying.
Coconut oil - very effective for aromatase and helps fight DHT. Speaking personally, this stuff is rocket fuel! Admittedly I was already on an established programme, but I got noticeable boob and areola growth almost immediately! Health benefits are another very long list (including weight loss). Can be difficult for some to take, but I have a trick. I warm it enough to make it liquid and add some smoothie. Before the oil has a chance to solidify I give it a quick whisk to emulsify the oil into the mix and then chug it down. Using a banana and strawberry blend and I hardly notice the coconut. I also found directly applying it onto the skin surprisingly effective. However, I went too much too quickly and gave myself seriously bad indigestion. Coconut oil is also a powerful anti-bacterial/anti-microbial/ant-fungal and it started clearing out my belly faster than it could handle. I am now taking it slow, but persevering as (for me) CO is too good not to stick with with.
White Peony (tincture) - to convert free testosterone into estrogen as an aromatse enabler. Some studies indicate WP can help with diabetes induced nerve damage, and also help with kidney and liver health.
Green Tea (Camellia sinensis) - profoundly supports NBE! directly and indirectly. An anti-androgen which inhibits the conversion of testosterone into DHT. Proven to help support the cardiovascular system and controlling diabetes. Helps with weight loss including reducing visceral fat. And is generally just too good all around not to include.
Vitamin D3 - is not just a vitamin, it is also a hormone and can increase estrogen synthesis (so take it with PM etc. so it works better ;-). Vitamin D is absolutely essential for bone health and can help reduce visceral fat and with general weight loss. However, it is possible to overdose and cause real health issues. Great stuff but take care.
Pueraria Mirifica (Kudzu) - The most potent phytoestrogen currently known but also a minor anti-androgen (reduces testosterone). For boob growth PM should be no more than 1000mg per day, though some report taking higher doses for other effects. Take Calcium with it. Indications are that PM can help with skin quality and improve circulation and may help with reducing appetite.
Fenugreek - Second to PM but may compete with it? Fenugreek can be progesterone-like and causes branching of ducts. it also inhibits DHT. Seems to act on fat distribution more than PM does and is supposed to slim the midsection. But can impact the effectiveness of other supplements and in particular will compete with PM (allow at least 4 hours between if taking both). Can cause side effects from an upset stomach to rashes and other allergic reactions. But helps with diabetes, weight loss and balance hormone levels.
My current programme, and I want to make clear this is my programme. I am not recommending it to anybody as I know my body well and all my life I have had to take higher doses of everything to get a response. If you are starting out PLEASE start off at much lower doses, listen to your body and take a slow ramp up.
Morning: PM (500mg). Calcium (300mg). WP (1 squirt sublingually) Reishi (1000mg) Vit D3 (one capsule)
Midday: PM (1000mg). Calcium (300mg). WP (1 squirt sublingually) Reishi (1000mg)
Teatime: FG (500mg). WP (1 squirt sublingually) Reishi (1000mg) Vit D3 (one capsule)
Night: FG(1000mg). WP (1 squirt sublingually) Reishi (1000mg)
Coconut Oil: Currently only externally to slowly build up tolerance (still getting a noticeable effect though :-). Working up to 1 tablespoon 3 x day internally, plus at least once a day externally on arms and chest, and when I can, thighs and butt.
Green Tea: As many cups as I can, but at least 4 a day.
I also take Evening Primrose Oil which is supposed to support NBE activity (though not sure to what degree), but I take it as much for help with CFS, diabetes and weight loss.
And finally, keep your health as a priority! Educate yourself so you know what it is you are taking and understand the risks involved. Side effects from some of the supplements talked about on this forum can be very real indeed and should not be ignored. Even the most magnificent set of breasts will be of little comfort if you ruined your health trying to get them. Some have paid a high price learning that lesson.
Phew! Realise there is a lot here but hope it proves helpful?
Won't bore you with my life history, but to give some context, I am in my 50's and slowly recovering from CFS, managing to whittle away at the weight I had gained and in remission from diabetes. So like many here, I do have health issues which affects what I chose to add or omit to my programme, which others may not. But I am not trying to make recommendations here anyway, just letting you all know what I am doing in the hope it may be of interest or help to somebody.
Current wisdom is to inhibit DHT and convert free testosterone to estradiol (estrogen) using a process called aromatase. And then supplement with an estrogen source which with DHT reduced can now work more effectively. But flooding the body with estrogen doesn't get you there any faster. Just enough is still enough. And testosterone isn't the poison, it's DHT, and without testosterone estrogen can't be made. DHT is the real enemy to stop breast growth. Inhibit DHT and breast growth will follow. However, a cautionary note. Bottoming out testosterone can bring on depression, weight gain and other health issues.
Scheduled breaks can be helpful. This can help take the load off the liver etc, and some have reported a jump in development after longer breaks. 5 days on and 2 days off seems to be a good option. Alternatively, taking 1 week out in 4. Milk Thistle is noted as being effective with cleansing the liver during the breaks.
Timing can influence effectiveness. Avoid taking around peak release times of DHT. Schedule for off peak times to administer supplements. Androgens (DHT) are highest at 8:00 am, with slight rises at noon, late afternoon and around 8:00 pm. So in other words, take at 10:00am, 2pm, 6pm and 10pm?
The current main weapons in our armoury are;
Red Reishi extract (LingZhi) - has an estrogenic action, is anti-inflammatory and very effective at blocking DHT (up to pharma levels). The health benefits of Reishi are too numerous to list! (seriously, it's a very long list) However, Reishi may lower blood pressure so caution needed. I prefer capsule form but be aware that Reishi extract is sold in different ratios. I have seen it available from 4-1 to 16-1 (the higher the more potent) so be aware of what you are buying.
Coconut oil - very effective for aromatase and helps fight DHT. Speaking personally, this stuff is rocket fuel! Admittedly I was already on an established programme, but I got noticeable boob and areola growth almost immediately! Health benefits are another very long list (including weight loss). Can be difficult for some to take, but I have a trick. I warm it enough to make it liquid and add some smoothie. Before the oil has a chance to solidify I give it a quick whisk to emulsify the oil into the mix and then chug it down. Using a banana and strawberry blend and I hardly notice the coconut. I also found directly applying it onto the skin surprisingly effective. However, I went too much too quickly and gave myself seriously bad indigestion. Coconut oil is also a powerful anti-bacterial/anti-microbial/ant-fungal and it started clearing out my belly faster than it could handle. I am now taking it slow, but persevering as (for me) CO is too good not to stick with with.
White Peony (tincture) - to convert free testosterone into estrogen as an aromatse enabler. Some studies indicate WP can help with diabetes induced nerve damage, and also help with kidney and liver health.
Green Tea (Camellia sinensis) - profoundly supports NBE! directly and indirectly. An anti-androgen which inhibits the conversion of testosterone into DHT. Proven to help support the cardiovascular system and controlling diabetes. Helps with weight loss including reducing visceral fat. And is generally just too good all around not to include.
Vitamin D3 - is not just a vitamin, it is also a hormone and can increase estrogen synthesis (so take it with PM etc. so it works better ;-). Vitamin D is absolutely essential for bone health and can help reduce visceral fat and with general weight loss. However, it is possible to overdose and cause real health issues. Great stuff but take care.
Pueraria Mirifica (Kudzu) - The most potent phytoestrogen currently known but also a minor anti-androgen (reduces testosterone). For boob growth PM should be no more than 1000mg per day, though some report taking higher doses for other effects. Take Calcium with it. Indications are that PM can help with skin quality and improve circulation and may help with reducing appetite.
Fenugreek - Second to PM but may compete with it? Fenugreek can be progesterone-like and causes branching of ducts. it also inhibits DHT. Seems to act on fat distribution more than PM does and is supposed to slim the midsection. But can impact the effectiveness of other supplements and in particular will compete with PM (allow at least 4 hours between if taking both). Can cause side effects from an upset stomach to rashes and other allergic reactions. But helps with diabetes, weight loss and balance hormone levels.
My current programme, and I want to make clear this is my programme. I am not recommending it to anybody as I know my body well and all my life I have had to take higher doses of everything to get a response. If you are starting out PLEASE start off at much lower doses, listen to your body and take a slow ramp up.
Morning: PM (500mg). Calcium (300mg). WP (1 squirt sublingually) Reishi (1000mg) Vit D3 (one capsule)
Midday: PM (1000mg). Calcium (300mg). WP (1 squirt sublingually) Reishi (1000mg)
Teatime: FG (500mg). WP (1 squirt sublingually) Reishi (1000mg) Vit D3 (one capsule)
Night: FG(1000mg). WP (1 squirt sublingually) Reishi (1000mg)
Coconut Oil: Currently only externally to slowly build up tolerance (still getting a noticeable effect though :-). Working up to 1 tablespoon 3 x day internally, plus at least once a day externally on arms and chest, and when I can, thighs and butt.
Green Tea: As many cups as I can, but at least 4 a day.
I also take Evening Primrose Oil which is supposed to support NBE activity (though not sure to what degree), but I take it as much for help with CFS, diabetes and weight loss.
And finally, keep your health as a priority! Educate yourself so you know what it is you are taking and understand the risks involved. Side effects from some of the supplements talked about on this forum can be very real indeed and should not be ignored. Even the most magnificent set of breasts will be of little comfort if you ruined your health trying to get them. Some have paid a high price learning that lesson.
Phew! Realise there is a lot here but hope it proves helpful?
