[Erin]

Who's chest is that? That's the one I want!

[Lotus]

Question: Ever wonder how much breasts weigh?, lol I do. Breasts weigh anywhere from (about) 1lb pound each, for an A-cup to 12 lb for a J-cup (each). I'm over simplifying this process, bear with me, please.

A pound of added fat is 3500 calories.

1) how many extra calories are needed to reach your goal?__________.

My plan would be add about 1 lb (pound) a week, or an extra 175 calories a day, in other words, 2 months should equate to a C-cup right?, hah.......we wish. not all new weight goes to the breasts, new fat goes where it's currently going (e.g, mid-section, hips (ok, lol) thighs, etc) unless you change (modify) how it's distributed.

FWIW, I'm reasonably certain my boobs are about 5 lbs each (D cup). The point I'm making is just this, the better we get at re-directing new fat towards breasts (which will be from peripheral tissues stimulation) the better we can manage overall fat metabolism.

3 Ways to Weigh Your Breasts - wikiHow
http://m.wikihow.com/Weigh-Your-Breasts

Contribution of breast volume and weight to body fat distribution in females.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/7416252


Measurement of breast volume in females: description of a reliable method.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/533239

Bra size
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brassiere_measurement

[pom19]

Thanks for this info Lotus. So as you said we don't want to take more calorie in, since it will go to wrong places, then how do we direct it toward a certain area? Thanks, POM

[Lotus]

Thanks for this info Lotus. So as you said we don't want to take more calorie in, since it will go to wrong places, then how do we direct it toward a certain area? Thanks, POM

Fats get broken down through the intestines and into the lymphatic/blood system. And oh btw, massaging breasts breakdowns fats into the lymphatic system and excreted. Which tells me massaging before you pump should be of more benefit, meaning, you don't want the fats you just stretched to be broken down and excreted, right?..........that's just my opinion. as I try to explain this, and no doubt it will be complex, I'd like to point out that the hormone Leptin (once again is a major player in breast growth, (think receptors, which Leptin receptors are in the breasts). Additionally, LEPTIN is present in breast milk, do we see a pattern here?. I will remind you that Aromatase is stimulated in the breasts by?????.....what else, LEPTIN.

Anyways, fats are broken into fatty acids which stimulate tissues, (taken from the reseach) e.g. when fats are being transported in the lymph or blood, large fat molecules need to be broken down into smaller fatty acids. The larger fats do not "attract" as many excess water molecules by osmosis as many smaller molecules would. Under the stimulation of insulin, these fatty acids are made into fat molecules and stored as fat droplets, aka, into tissues). And this is where it gets interesting......

Researchers identify ‘fat gene’ associated with obesity - See more at: http://news.uchicago.edu/article/2014/03...sity#.dpuf

Researchers isolate a gene that controls body mass and regulates body composition, which has an ability to be resistant to a high Fat induced diet, in other words it handles glucose better and protects against diabetes C.

Hypothalamic function of IRX3, therefore, appears to control body mass and composition in these animals, indicating that the genetic predisposition to obesity is wired in the brain.

FTO gene-Fat mass and obesity-associated protein also known as alpha-ketoglutarate-dependent dioxygenase FTO is an enzyme that in humans is encoded by the FTO gene located on chromosome 16.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/FTO_gene

exercise more, eat more= (partial growth)
restrict calories = slow metabolism (no growth)
add intermittent fasting mixed with HIIT=growth hormone
energy from fat stores is highly concentrated

This is where Ketosis (or ketogenesis) comes in, nearing starvation the body goes into a ketogenic state. Ketogenesis doesn’t destroy muscle tissue, but is rather the process by which stored fat is turned into ketones — a perfectly usable energy source for every major body system.

The body fat setpoint is the mass of body fat that your body attempts to defend against changes in either direction. It’s your body’s attempt to maintain homeostasis.

HOW TO BURN STORED BODY FAT — A KETOSIS PRIMER
http://www.foodrenegade.com/how-to-burn-...is-primer/

Ok, I understand. I'll put it this way, you've had the benefit of some glandular growth (with awesome puffies) .....You want fat distribution to the breasts, correct?. Ok then, getting fat to peripheral tissues (breasts) without causing obesity is the desired outcome? (I'm guessing).

This (breast growth) is using a (or tuning) a multiple of hormones/proteins/fats/exercise/fasting. Simply put, I think we need to be in constant state of Flux (otherwise known as FAT FLUX) state where we add and burn fat while modulating hormones and proteins. In other words Breast growth comes from a stimulation of hormones (other things I noted, nerd stuff) and an increase of fat cells, (longer, elongated and rounded in that makes sense). This is simialr state of ketosis, but a modified state of ketosis (imo) it's something talked about but not fully understood, I've been thinking (trying to figure it out) about this for sometime.

We want healthy breast growth without the complications of weight, DVT, stress on our livers, cancer, etc. Liberatiing fat cells in peripheral tissues seems a likely prospect. Help is welcomed to add to this conversation.

FAT FLUX: enzymes, regulators, and pathophysiology of intracellular lipolysis
http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/store/10.15252/emmm.201404846/asset/emmm201404846.pdf?v=1&t=iif6phme&s=4bb1f679be867a087e2bc66597ee5eb8d003becc

Progesterone 1/4 teaspoon daily, (applied to breasts [not nipples, which causes freckles on the areolas]).
Green tea 2-3 cups extract to promote Leptin (or green coffee bean extract)
Coconut oil (1-2 tablespoons) to help synthesis of new fat cells
Fat in, Fat out----that fat flux I described (e.g. activation of Lipogenesis of fat cells, then followed by NBE/ Hrt and then exercise, HITT preferably).

So sorry Bielz, I'm honestly not trying to confuse, I think it's the direction new breast growth needs to take. Btw, Leptin is the satiety hormone (tells we are full) and ghrelin is the hunger hormones (tells us to eat), if too much ghrelin is produced Leptin is inactivated, which means estrogen is not being activated to synthesize aromatase, in other words a missed opportunity of free growth.

[hannah]

Hi Lotuss, I was reading this:

Available research suggests that doses of more than 25 milligrams of lycopene daily may lower levels of low-density lipoprotein (LDL, or "bad") cholesterol and total cholesterol. Although this is promising, more high-quality research is needed in this area.

And I thought about the 'fat in fat out' sentence in the big post up here, could this be of help?.... Lowering ldl helps fat storage? Or is this totally off route..bc im already on green tea and coconutoil etc. Im searching for something new..

[Lotus]

Hi Lotuss, I was reading this:

Available research suggests that doses of more than 25 milligrams of lycopene daily may lower levels of low-density lipoprotein (LDL, or "bad") cholesterol and total cholesterol. Although this is promising, more high-quality research is needed in this area.

And I thought about the 'fat in fat out' sentence in the big post up here, could this be of help?.... Lowering ldl helps fat storage? Or is this totally off route..bc im already on green tea and coconutoil etc. Im searching for something new..

Hi Hannah,

This fat in/fat out is what I think that FAT Flux does for our fat cells, meaning that energy from new fat is used within that hour, in others words fuel for breasts cells to synthesize new growth. This is just a theory (lol, mine), but, I see the science, now extrapolating into NBE is the tough part. Emulsification in the intestines (or should I say, better Emulsification) is tied to progesterone and testosterone, (through a network of enzymes), I know, more complexity. however, insulin is the master control here, imo. Green tea helps in burning fat, (I think other fat supps can be helpful too), which can help fight LDL. Exercising can also benefit getting rid of storing the new fat. However, stored fats house estrogen, isn't that a huge potential to burn that stored estrogen?, I would think so considering we continue to add more and more phytoestrogens/estradiol. Studies show that the half life in E2 (Pharma) is present for days, so we may not think its (E2) there working (so I take more) but it's still working). TTYL


It is also possible for fat cells to take up glucose and amino acids, which have been absorbed into the bloodstream after a meal, and convert those into fat molecules. The conversion of carbohydrates or protein into fat is 10 times less efficient than simply storing fat in a fat cell, but the body can do it. If you have 100 extra calories in fat (about 11 grams) floating in your bloodstream, fat cells can store it using only 2.5 calories of energy. On the other hand, if you have 100 extra calories in glucose (about 25 grams) floating in your bloodstream, it takes 23 calories of energy to convert the glucose into fat and then store it. Given a choice, a fat cell will grab the fat and store it rather than the carbohydrates because fat is so much easier to store.

How Fat Cells Work
http://science.howstuffworks.com/life/ce...-cell2.htm



   

[pom19]

[quote='pom19' pid='166840' dateline='1450753595']
Thanks for this info Lotus. So as you said we don't want to take more calorie in, since it will go to wrong places, then how do we direct it toward a certain area? Thanks, POM

Fats get broken down through the intestines and into the lymphatic/blood system. And oh btw, massaging breasts breakdowns fats into the lymphatic system and excreted. Which tells me massaging before you pump should be of more benefit, meaning, you don't want the fats you just stretched to be broken down and excreted, right?..........that's just my opinion. as I try to explain this, and no doubt it will be complex, I'd like to point out that the hormone Leptin (once again is a major player in breast growth, (think receptors, which Leptin receptors are in the breasts). Additionally, LEPTIN is present in breast milk, do we see a pattern here?. I will remind you that Aromatase is stimulated in the breasts by?????.....what else, LEPTIN. .....


----------------------------------
Thanks Lotus. POM

[Marcy]

Ok, my theory!

1) Increase Hormones

*Estrogen
*Prolactin
*Progesterone
*Growth Hormones

2) Reduce DHT/ unlock free testosterone / bind SBGH

3) Convert Aromatase

4) Slow the breakdown of estrogen metabolism

First post.... this right here is fantastic information. Thank you

[Marcy]

Instead of having 3-4 threads talking about male NBE needs I'm condensing all of them into one, making it streamlined for ease of use and reference. Big thanks to our friend jacp!

5 hormones needed for breast growth:

1) Estrogen- are a group of compounds named for their importance in both menstrual and estrous reproductive cycles. They are the primary female sex hormones. Natural estrogens are steroid hormones, while some synthetic ones are non-steroidal.

2) Progesterone -Progesterone is produced in the ovaries (by the corpus luteum), the adrenal glands (near the kidney), and, during pregnancy, in the placenta. Progesterone is also stored in adipose (fat) tissue. but it can also be increased through the use of natural progesterone cream, which is derived from soy or wild yam. PC can be useful for bio-males

3) Prolactin- Prolactin (PRL), also known as lactotrope, is a protein that in humans is probably best known for its role in enabling female mammals to produce milk, increases fat stores in the breasts. Massaging breasts stimulates prolactin.

4) Growth Hormone-also known as somatotropin or somatropin, is a peptide hormone that stimulates growth, cell reproduction and regeneration in humans and other animals. It is a type of mitogen which is specific only to certain kinds of cells. Growth hormone is a 191-amino acid, single-chain polypeptide that is synthesized, stored, and secreted by somatotropic cells within the lateral wings of the anterior pituitary gland.

5) Testosterone -is converted into estrogen by a process called aromatase. The aromatase process takes place in the body’s fat cells, which create a special substance called an aromatase enzyme which converts excess testosterone into estrogen.

Definitions-

Aromatase: An enzyme involved in the production of estrogen that acts by catalyzing the conversion of testosterone (an androgen) to estradiol (an estrogen).


Aromatase inhibitors(AIs) are a class of drugs used in the treatment of breast cancer and ovarian cancer in postmenopausal women. They may also be used off-label to treat or prevent gynaecomastia in men.
Aromatase is the enzyme that synthesizes estrogen. As breast and ovarian cancers require estrogen to grow, AIs are taken to either block the production of estrogen or block the action of estrogen on receptors.

Pro-Hormones -refers to a committed intra-glandular precursor of a hormone, usually having minimal hormonal effect by itself. The term has been used in medical science since the middle of the 20th century. Though not hormones themselves, prohormones amplify the effects of existing hormones. Examples of natural, human prohormones include proinsulin and pro-opiomelanocortin.

Potentiator-is a drug, herb, or chemical that intensifies the effects of a

The Three E's, (E1), (E2), (E3)
(E1)-Estrone (E1, and also oestrone) is an estrogenic hormone secreted by the ovary as well as adipose tissue,Estrone is the least abundant of the three hormones; estradiol is present almost always in the reproductive female body, and estriol is abundant primarily during pregnancy. (E2),Estradiol is about 10 times as potent as estrone and about 80 times as potent as estriol in its estrogenic effect (E3) Estriol is only produced in significant amounts during pregnancy as it is made by the placenta.

Androgens also called androgenic hormone or testoid, is the generic term for any natural or synthetic compound, usually a steroid hormone, that stimulates or controls the development and maintenance of male characteristics in vertebrates by binding to androgen receptors.

Anti-androgens,-or androgen antagonists, first discovered in the 1960s, prevent androgens from expressing their biological effects on responsive tissues.Antiandrogens alter the androgen pathway by blocking the appropriate receptors, competing for binding sites on the cell's surface, or affecting androgen production.

Estrogen receptors -are a group of proteins found inside cells. They are receptors that are activated by the hormone estrogen (17β-estradiol).

Sex hormone-binding globulin-Sex hormone-binding globulin (SHBG) or sex steroid-binding globulin (SSBG) is a glycoprotein that binds to sex hormones, to be specific, androgens and estrogens. Other steroid hormones such as progesterone, cortisol, and other corticosteroids are bound by transcortin.


Free testosterone-is a term that refers to the amount of testosterone in the bloodstream, usually tested in males with certain medical conditions. According to the American Association for Clinical Chemistry (AACC), free testosterone only accounts for 1-4 percent of the testosterone in a typical male's bloodstream.

5-ar - 5 alpha reductase - converts testosterone into dht.

Cyp 19 - Aromatase gene - You can find articles on herbs that increase aromatase via this search term

DHT- Dihydrotestosterone - The most potent androgen, destroys fat, and masculinizes.

DHEA - Dehydroepiandrosterone - Building block hormone for everything else.

Steroidogenesis -is the biological process by which steroids are generated from cholesterol and transformed into other steroids.[The pathways of steroidogenesis differ between different species – as an example the pathways of human steroidogenesis are shown in this figure below: The major classes of steroid hormones and some prominent members of the human steroidogenesis are:

See attached file for the hormonal pathway-

Estrogenic Herbs:
Pueraria Mirifica - Awesome for breast growth.
Red Clover - Minor aromatase inhibitor, but highly estrogenic. Binds some to alpha estrogen receptors(boob growth receptor).
Hops - Not as estrogenic as PM or red clover, but activates alpha estrogen receptors which stimulate breast growth.

Pro-hormone's:
DHEA - The direct building block of other hormones
Fish oil - provides plenty of good fats and nutrients for hormone production.
FATS/Protein - Go to town. The more fats you take in the more your body has for hormone production. Cholesterol is a direct building block for all other hormones. No more 'light' anything. Whole and saturated fats.
Bovine ovaries - Also estrogenic, and I think pro-aromatase, as well as 5-AR inhibiting.

Pro-Aromatase:
Peony Root - Estrogenic, blocks 5ar and pro-aromatase - Strong.
genistein - Estrogenic and pro-aromatase
Licorice - Anti-androgenic and activates alpha and beta estrogen receptors and blocks 5-ar - Strong, but take in moderation! Link with more info.

Potentiators:
Dandelion root - Good for detoxing the liver, and upregulates estrogen receptors so your body uses the estrogen you are putting in.
Nettle Root - Binds to SHBG (hormone that binds to excess hormones decreasing hormone levels), and decreases 5ar and aromatase. Taking this tends to increase estrogen and testosterone. Would need to be taken with a pro-aromatase, and maybe estrogen.
PABA - Decreases breakdown of estrogen in your body so you have more free estrogen.
Gaba - Increases growth hormone
Grape fruit - Slow the breakdown of estrogen
Deer velvet - Increases growth hormone

Theory:
Breasts grow with a mixture of estrogen and growth hormone. This happens naturally, because your body reacts to estrogens by releasing growth hormone, but I'm thinking you could add supplement to this. Or that estrogen acts as the growth hormone. Bovine ovaries causes a whole cascade of estrogens and growth hormone release, which is why it seems like it is so effective.

So a solid cycle could look like:
1 estrogenic herb
1 pro-hormone
1 pro-aromatase
1 potentiator (vitamins/minerals, etc)

Don't forget about the endocrine system!

http://www.breastnexus.com/attachment.php?aid=5244




Please add/subtract to the list as needed-

Reference : http://wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia

Great boiled down information in this group of posts!

[Eloise]

Lotus, you forgot one extra special ingredient for breast growth: patience. We are all boob greedy but you cannot rush a good thing. But patience does not mean 'do nothing'--there's a lot. For one, there's overall nutrition, exercise, and massaging. It's a full time job. You've taught me that!