[Alison59]

Some of the evidence is compromised however as those studies were conducted after the subjects had taken hormones

http://mindhacks.com/2009/04/05/imaging-...red-brain/

A study conducted before any form of hormone treatment:

http://cercor.oxfordjournals.org/content...hu194.full

Powerful things hormones, also behaviour has considerable effects on altering brain function

[Dianna1395]

I doubt any Transsexual out there thinks they've become FEMALE after the surgery. They merely resemble women as closely as possible.

Transsexuals (MtF in this example) have female brain structures already. Autopsies and MRI scans have shown that. They are not becoming female, their brains/minds are female (or more female than they should be to reside in a male body). They are trying to align their body with their already female mind/brain.

The doctors even know when it happens. Endocrine disruptions to the foetus in weeks 15/16 prevents the brain from masculinsing in MTFs or may over-masculinise it in FTMs depending on what goes wrong. In MTFs in recent years (1960s/70s/80s) the endocrine disruptor seems to have been a pregnancy drug called Diethylstilbesterol which is now banned.

Yup, yup! :-)
Except my understanding is, DES was mostly OUT by 1975. (Personal research, that was a concern for me.)

The cause is less important to me than the (re)solution. Meaning, it's great to know the issue occurred in vitro week 15/16, but I'm more interested in how we deal with it later, now that the brain regions and connections are confirmed to match the target sex (nee Gender Expression.) :-P

Now, if we came to this "sane"? We won't manage to remain that way when we find the looking glass is a pass-through...

[Dianna1395]

[SNIP]
I don't think, many will dispute that... But still, they were brought up the "wrong" gender... So, they will still have issues to overcome even if they could win beauty contest's as a female....

Yeah - I've tried to explain it to people in the past, and they... Can't comprehend.

I try to explain it as:
We act normally, and get reprimanded for it. People laugh, or call us names.
So, we learn to filter what we say and do. Within a brief period, it becomes second-nature to second-guess. We filter everything we do and think and say to make sure we pass the "gender test" of our peers. We hide the rest. (Freud, Repression, much?)

I've only tried once or twice, and I don't think they understand it. At least with LGB, it's external: who they are attracted to. We can't even use these terms, as our issues are internal, and we're essentially hermaphroditic. We aren't "male" or "female" so much as "masculine" and "feminine." It's not just the penis that shouldn't be there, or the breasts that should be there; it's that the brain's components don't work according to the OEM manual for "Male" or "Female." Like Gir, the robot from Invader Zim: A box of spare parts was tossed in, and whatever works, works. (Sometimes Zim does what he's supposed to; sometimes he misfires. I know I raised some eyebrows when I commented on a girl's nail polish... She was wearing Construction Cone Orange, for f*ck's sake! How could I NOT comment? Not appropriate, even at a pro wrestling event. Garish! )

Don't worry about the Yankees. (Carpetbaggers, Yankees, etc: The people who want to mind YOUR business. Their nose is so far up your tucus you choke regularly. Think NSA...)

Just live life to the best (Breast? ;-) ) you can. Be the best YOU you can be.
You can't explain color to the blind. And until the foundation of the house is squared away, you can't true the walls anyway - it's just not going to work. It's like arranging the deck chairs on the Titanic.

We're working on the foundation, in a house that's already built for us. We can fix the biggest flaw, and then work on the other issues; or, we can conform to the blind "experts" who have pre-conceived notions, and want to make US fit THEIR ideals, and ... Live much the same way we have been living.

I've done that in every arena of my life, so I'm not willing to keep doing it. There's nothing down that road, Neo. ;-)

-Dianna

[jannet.duff]

I know I raised some eyebrows when I commented on a girl's nail polish... She was wearing Construction Cone Orange, for f*ck's sake! How could I NOT comment? Not appropriate, even at a pro wrestling event. Garish! )


-Dianna

I can understand that one, it's hard as heck when you see some girl at work with a nice top on and you either almost comment on it or ask her were she picked it up.

[breastman59]

Late to the party here but thought I would comment. I am one of the heterosexuals with kids the "woke" up one day and was gay....not really...had known for ever of my strong attraction to men...but where it gets interesting is that I can very easily think of myself as a woman in a sexual relationship....I can remember as far back 10 that I would go to sleep at night praying,pleading that I would wake up the next morning with breasts where they were supposed to be....since divorced 8 years ago has only gotten incredibly stronger...have tried pm several times..but chickened out.....that guy panics...then she takes over months to a year later and hits me upside the head...so I try again...he wimps out.....been ongoing for years like this.....now the gid is incredibly hard to deal with.....but the intersting thing is...I have never fully crossdressed....14 or 15 loved to put on my mothers stockings.....felt so good....felt as it should be, so thinking it was a bit more than crossdressing......talk about a messed up person huh???

[Dianna1395]

Late to the party here but thought I would comment. I am one of the heterosexuals with kids the "woke" up one day and was gay....not really...had known for ever of my strong attraction to men...but where it gets interesting is that I can very easily think of myself as a woman in a sexual relationship....I can remember as far back 10 that I would go to sleep at night praying,pleading that I would wake up the next morning with breasts where they were supposed to be....since divorced 8 years ago has only gotten incredibly stronger...have tried pm several times..but chickened out.....that guy panics...then she takes over months to a year later and hits me upside the head...so I try again...he wimps out.....been ongoing for years like this.....now the gid is incredibly hard to deal with.....but the intersting thing is...I have never fully crossdressed....14 or 15 loved to put on my mothers stockings.....felt so good....felt as it should be, so thinking it was a bit more than crossdressing......talk about a messed up person huh???

Hi, BreastMan,
I don't get attraction to men, but I get the sudden building demotion and feeling. I think we as men ( males?) tend to project and defer. Our female companion is our avatar in femine finery. She tries to meet our desires (be attractive to us).
Remove that feminine beauty from our lives, we need to find a release.... We become that female. And then, the stresses are so much less, it's essentially a pleasure....

So it's reinforced. Its addictive.
Insert a new woman, the urges submerge again, more or less.
- Dianna

[AlexisRene]

You can't explain color to the blind.

-Dianna

The above is my fav line. In contrast & peculiar thing to me is that gender in society is binary black & white interpretation. Therefore, we feel what we show on the outside must match blanket expectation.

The problem is that real people are very much a span of gray between b & w. Recent years have been more liberating in general. The umbrella label of trans or gender identity dysphoria can turn to either push back or contests of how trans one is.
Whether online or at various transgender gatherings have witnessed divides among the groups within. Have even seen some movement or groups that want gender markers thrown out completely(personally disagree with that concept). But it is out there.

My point is, just be you. Seek & define your personal goals to keep moving forward. (side note: not saying ditch the wife,kids, family, responsibilities). Am sure there are groups or counselors in most given locations of somewhat like minded individuals that can shed some light. Am from central IL & it is kind of dim here, but know there are some resources. Would think the same for IA. It is amazing & empowering the differences when meeting in person vs forums/social media.

& just for fun. Know someone mentioned make up artist Amanda in PA. She truly is great. There is a girl in Chicago that works with trans people, gender neutral, women what ever label one needs as well for anyone interested. Am sure there are many more, but just throwing the link out there just in case it helps someone. http://florinamakeupartist.com/

[flamesabers]

You can't explain color to the blind.

-Dianna

The above is my fav line. In contrast & peculiar thing to me is that gender in society is binary black & white interpretation. Therefore, we feel what we show on the outside must match blanket expectation.

I may be nitpicking here, but it's possible to explain color to the blind people who didn't have the condition at birth. I'm not a musician, but from what I've read, even after becoming totally deaf, Beethoven still knew what his music sounded like due to audiation.

My point is people may find a way to understand through means you may not expect. While the concept of having a gender identity that is non-congruent with the body's sex may be bizarre to most people, perhaps people would be more receptive to scientific evidence rather than an abstract concept?

[AlexisRene]

I may be nitpicking here, but it's possible to explain color to the blind people who didn't have the condition at birth. I'm not a musician, but from what I've read, even after becoming totally deaf, Beethoven still knew what his music sounded like due to audiation.

My point is people may find a way to understand through means you may not expect. While the concept of having a gender identity that is non-congruent with the body's sex may be bizarre to most people, perhaps people would be more receptive to scientific evidence rather than an abstract concept?

I was metaphorically basing off of trying to explain color to someone who had never had their vision.

For me, I knew as a child my feelings were different. Was more so matching the girls & feeling outcast with the boys. But growing up in a rural community long before the internet, made sure to bury it as deep as possible. A few years later, remember when the news broke about Caroline Cossey who as an extra on a James Bond movie was transgender. Had no idea that any of that was possible, but it correlated within. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Caroline_Cossey

But even at that, still buried everything. Common sense screamed why would anyone go through that sort of emotional & physical pain, health risks, potential social disaster(s) to transition? Would my parents throw me out or send me away? Would there even be happiness on the other side?

To keep this short, it was still years later coming to terms with things, but the key for me was communication. Body parts are just that, parts. But if the gender between your ears does not match the outer appearance, one cannot communicate properly nor effectively. That truly was & is the key for me.

Even though I was affected personally, my mindset was to stay the course, avoid the risk, blend in. Had so hoped that all of this was a choice & scientific data likely would not have had an effect. It literally took a multitude of things to come together & finding a key so to speak for me to understand.

So back to the color spectrum metaphor. I knew the colors, but failed or refused to interpret them properly. How would I ever explain the colors to someone who had never seen them? Much less apply an identifying label to them.

[The First Aria]

O.k., but after all, I have no genetic disease that would make me tilt one way or another... I am a late bloomer, and I was looking for other's that maybe that way.

I truly have great sympathy for people like Caroline Cossey and people like that... But, that doesn't explain me or people like me..