[missboobshirt]

ps: I see that chinese red yeast is an herb? would you recommend that for lowering DHT?

[Lotus]

"I could have had a V8!"

"Lycopene is a natural antioxidant found primarily in tomatoes and tomato products. It gives tomatoes their red color. Research suggests that diets rich in tomatoes and tomato products may have long-term health benefits. V8® Vegetable Juice contains 17.5mg of lycopene per 8-ounce serving, which is over five times the amount found in a medium-sized tomato."

https://www.campbells.com/v8/faqs/

Thanks Marcy,

Indeed, I'll take one too. as you can see in the study below, lycopene inhibits DHT. Works for me.

autocrine/paracrine loops in the Dunning prostate cancer model.
Siler U1, Barella L, Spitzer V, Schnorr J, Lein M, Goralczyk R, Wertz K.
Author information

* 1DSM Nutritional Products, Human Nutrition and Health, Carotenoid Section, Basel, Switzerland.
Abstract
Epidemiological studies have consistently associated high intakes of lycopene or vitamin E with a reduced prostate cancer risk. Both compounds were tested in the MatLyLu Dunning prostate cancer model to gain insight into the in vivo action of lycopene and vitamin E. Supplementation for 4 weeks with 200 ppm lycopene, 540 ppm vitamin E, or both led to plasma levels comparable with those in humans. Both compounds also accumulated in tumor tissue. Macroscopic evaluation of the tumors by magnetic resonance imaging showed a significant increase in necrotic area in the vitamin E and the lycopene treatment groups. Microarray analysis of tumor tissues revealed that both compounds regulated local gene expression. Vitamin E reduced androgen signaling without affecting androgen metabolism. Lycopene interfered with local testosterone activation by down-regulating 5-alpha-reductase and consequently reduced steroid target genes expression (cystatin-related protein 1 and 2, prostatic spermine binding protein, prostatic steroid binding protein C1, C2 and C3 chain, probasin). In addition, lycopene down-regulated prostatic IGF-I and IL-6 expression. Based on these findings, we suggest that lycopene and vitamin E contribute to the reduction of prostate cancer by interfering with internal autocrine or paracrine loops of sex steroid hormone and growth factor activation/synthesis and signaling in the prostate.

[Lotus]

warning: penis information ahead (no pun). If discussing the penis offends thee, well then, proceed no further........cause, we gonna talk!.


The fact that estrogen receptors and aromatase are localized in a diverse subpopulation of penile cells, including neurons, epithelia, stroma, glandular cells, suggests that its function in the penis is likely to be cell- specific and complex (Jesmin et al., 2002, 2004; Crescioli et al., 2003; Dietrich et al., 2004; Goyal et al., 2004; Vignozzi et al., 2004).


We've discussed estrogen being produced (synthesized) in the testes, and aromatase stored in germ cells, epididymis, and is and present in spermatozoa. We've even talked about how DHT can be turned into estrogen via the DHT metabolite 3beta-diol.

Oops, almost forget, the density of 5 alpha reductase is strongly present on the head of the penis. With that aside, please read this pdf:


The penis: a new target and source of estrogen in male reproduction http://www.hh.um.es/pdf/Vol_21/21_1/Mowa...7-2006.pdf

Summary. In the past decade, interest and knowledge in the role of estrogen in male reproduction and fertility has gained significant momentum. More recently, the cellular distribution and activity of estrogen receptors (α and ß)(ER) and aromatase (estrogen synthesis) has been reported in the penis, making the penis the latest “frontier” in the study of estrogen in male reproduction. ER and aromatase are broadly and abundantly expressed in various penile compartments and cell types (erectile tissues, urethral epithelia, vascular and neuronal cells), suggesting the complexity and significance of the estrogen-ER system in penile events. Unraveling this complexity is important and will require utilization of the various resources that are now at our disposal including, animal models and human lacking or deficient in ER and aromatase and the use of advanced and sensitive techniques. Some of the obvious areas that require our attention include: 1) a comprehensive mapping of ER-α and -ß cellular expression in the different penile compartments and subpopulations of cells, 2) delineation of the specific roles of estrogen in the different subpopulations of cells, 3) establishing the relationship of the estrogen-ER system with the androgen-androgen receptor system, if any, and 4) characterizing the specific penile phenotypes in human and animals lacking or deficient in estrogen and ER. Some data generated thus far, although preliminary, appear to challenge the long held dogma that, overall, androgens have a regulatory monopoly of penile development and function.

What does this mean?. For starters, estrogen(s) have a huge impact on the male reproductive organs: for those who still don't believe Aromatase has any impact in male anatomy I say, they (you!) are sadly mistaken and read the study.

Edit: viewing the illustration (see pdf) on the location (and amounts) of estrogen receptors in the penis, imo it's suggesting the penis to be a target organ for delivery of estrogens........get my meaning?. On the other hand, this should also explain why we see a decrease in the size of the penis (from estrogen), aka a successful program.

Fig. 8. Schematic diagram shows an overview distribution of ER in the penile tissues (glans penis, penis spongiosus, penis cavernosus, penile urethra). Bottom right, cross section of penis.

Estrogens, 17ß-estradiol and estrone, are produced from C19 androgens, testosterone and androstanedione, respectively, by cytochrome P450 arom (P450arom), a product of CYP19 gene. P450arom is a mono-oxygenase microsomal enzyme complex present in endoplasmic reticulum that irreversibly converts the aromatizable C19 androgens to estrogens through 3 consecutive hydroxylation reactions at the A-ring (Lephart 1996; Pereyra-Martinez et al. 2001; Carreau et al. 2002; Wiszniewska 2002). Aromatase is expressed in a tissue- specific manner and is composed of two proteins, namely, 1) a ubiquitous NADPH-cytochrome P450 reductase and 2) a cytochrome P450 aromatase, which contain the heme and the steroid pocket (Lephart 1996; Carreau et al. 1999, 2002).

Apologies, I will respond to the other posts.

[spanky (aka Lola)]

Thanks, Lotus. That is some very interesting information. One question I have is whether the clitoris is similarly endowed with an abundance of estrogen receptors and aromatase activity.

[Lotus]

What IF... You are allergic to nightshades , ie tomatoes, would it then in fact be pro inflammatory?..

Yupppp!.

Nightshade plants and vegetables have been linked to chronic inflammation in the body leading to a variety of symptoms and illnesses.
http://www.naturalhealth365.com/nightsha...-1437.html

Ok, then how about kiwi fruit........??

Kiwifruit is a rich source of ascorbic acid (vitamin C) and other health-beneficial compounds. Our analyses demonstrated that extensive expansions have occurred in the members of gene families involved in the ascorbic acid biosynthetic and recycling pathway, the carotenoid biosynthesis pathway and the flavonoid metabolism pathway.
https://www.researchgate.net/profile/Hongkun_Zheng/publication/258055745_Draft_genome_of_the_kiwifruit_Actinidia_chinensis/links/00b7d5396e3723d9ef000000.pdf?inViewer=0&pdfJsDownload=0&origin=publication_detail


Happy mitochondria = happy gonads. (somebody acuatully quoted that). In other words, Protein Biosynthesis.

[pom19]

Wow Lotus, never thought a veggie can do that!!! Thanks for the info. POM

[Lotus]

Wow Lotus, never thought a veggie can do that!!! Thanks for the info. POM

Hi Pom, surprising huh?. Sensitivities, intolerances, allergies... makes my head swim too Ella. I see gluten-intolerance is mentioned again, I'll mention it again here, I think (perhaps) NBE should be gluten free. Think about it, remove triggers that cause inflammation, intestinal cramping, bloating etc. and breast growth shows up later. So far, it's just a theory. Take a 30 day trail free of known individaul triggers and see what happens.


Btw, kiwi fruit inhibits the CYP3A4 enzyme, which means it acts like a lighter version of grape fruit in the intestines. meaning combining NBE products that inhibit CYP3A4 goes nuclear upon first pass metabolism. (upregulating them)

[ellacraig]

Wow Lotus, never thought a veggie can do that!!! Thanks for the info. POM

Hi Pom, surprising huh?. Sensitivities, intolerances, allergies... makes my head swim too Ella. I see gluten-intolerance is mentioned again, I'll mention it again here, I think (perhaps) NBE should be gluten free. Think about it, remove triggers that cause inflammation, intestinal cramping, bloating etc. and breast growth shows up later. So far, it's just a theory. Take a 30 day trail free of known individaul triggers and see what happens.


Btw, kiwi fruit inhibits the CYP3A4 enzyme, which means it acts like a lighter version of grape fruit in the intestines. meaning combining NBE products that inhibit CYP3A4 goes nuclear upon first pass metabolism. (upregulating them)

Yeh I think you may be right with gluten.
I had a muffin/normal wheat bread sandwich yest cause we were boating. Anyway an hour or two later my intestines were in agony. Gas for Africa.
Same thing today was pretty good all dat, then had a small bag of potatoe chips and shortly after huge gas build up and cramps. Dunno what's in pot Chips gluten or wheat? But yeh...

Also for nightshades even worse if you have an EXISTING gastro intestinal disorder. More inflammation... She says baking up roast potatoes for dinner....
It's a shame cause cayenne is considered a nightshade too and I'd love to consume more.

I wonder if peppers are nightshades?

[Lotus]

Wow Lotus, never thought a veggie can do that!!! Thanks for the info. POM

Hi Pom, surprising huh?. Sensitivities, intolerances, allergies... makes my head swim too Ella. I see gluten-intolerance is mentioned again, I'll mention it again here, I think (perhaps) NBE should be gluten free. Think about it, remove triggers that cause inflammation, intestinal cramping, bloating etc. and breast growth shows up later. So far, it's just a theory. Take a 30 day trail free of known individaul triggers and see what happens.


Btw, kiwi fruit inhibits the CYP3A4 enzyme, which means it acts like a lighter version of grape fruit in the intestines. meaning combining NBE products that inhibit CYP3A4 goes nuclear upon first pass metabolism. (upregulating them)

Yeh I think you may be right with gluten.
I had a muffin/normal wheat bread sandwich yest cause we were boating. Anyway an hour or two later my intestines were in agony. Gas for Africa.
Same thing today was pretty good all dat, then had a small bag of potatoe chips and shortly after huge gas build up and cramps. Dunno what's in pot Chips gluten or wheat? But yeh...

Also for nightshades even worse if you have an EXISTING gastro intestinal disorder. More inflammation... She says baking up roast potatoes for dinner....
It's a shame cause cayenne is considered a nightshade too and I'd love to consume more.

I wonder if peppers are nightshades?

It looks possible peppers might be, Ella. Kiwi could be going in the wrong direction for with allergies in some:

Kiwi fruit is a significant allergen and is associated with differing patterns of reactivity in children and adults

CONCLUSIONS:
Kiwi fruit should be considered a significant food allergen, capable of causing severe reactions, particularly in young children. DBPCFC confirmed allergy to kiwi fruit in 53% of the subjects tested, who had a previous history suggestive of kiwi allergy. Skin testing with fresh fruit has good sensitivity (93%), but poor specificity (45%) in this population. CAP sIgE and a commercially available skin test solution were both much less sensitive (54%; 75%) but had better specificity (90%; 67%).
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/15248859

[ellacraig]

What IF... You are allergic to nightshades , ie tomatoes, would it then in fact be pro inflammatory?..

Maybe, I would think what the substance is that would cause one to be allergic.

That would be a great question for a Doctor or at least a Dietician.

Oh well add that to the bloody lists then.
No kiwifruit
No tropical
No apples
No citrus
No gluten
No wheat
No dairy
No chicken
No red meat
No night shades
No caffeine
No alcohol
No sugar
No peanuts
No avocado
No tuna fish
No crab or shell fish
No fermented or yeast foods

These are alllll the things I've been told I'm allergic too and should not eat...
By varying practioners and methods.

Guess that leaves lettus leaves and grass. Should have been born a cow. Be left with more options right?