[AbiDrew85]

Pill form. And you're correct. 818 on the dot.

Well obviously. That product is pill form. What I was asking about is with food, without food, how long before food, did you make sure to drink enough water, take anything else at the same time?

[Dana Mantra Eon]

How was it supposed to be obvious to me that you knew the product was pill form? All I heard was "in what form are were you taking it in" which I'll admit, was a misinterpretation, but there was certainly no way for me to know you already knew the exact nature of the product.

I took it about a half hour before food, with water, and 540 mg of SP. I'd usually wait at least ten minutes before taking my PM. Throughout the day, my aim was about 1/2 gallon of water, but I didn't always reach that goal.

[AbiDrew85]

How was it supposed to be obvious to me that you knew the product was pill form? All I heard was "in what form are were you taking it in" which I'll admit, was a misinterpretation, but there was certainly no way for me to know you already knew the exact nature of the product.

I took it about a half hour before food, with water, and 540 mg of SP. I'd usually wait at least ten minutes before taking my PM. Throughout the day, my aim was about 1/2 gallon of water, but I didn't always reach that goal.

Um, because you named the product and I did a quick google, which is how I was able to know what figure to use to arrive at the amount of EGCg, and I asked "how" not "what form"? Asking someone a how question is asking about procedure...

Anyways, okay, it sounds to me like there are two possibilities, either, A: the SP and GT were somehow having an interaction, because I've stopped taking SP a long time ago so wouldn't really know, we'd have to have other people who were taking a GTE and SP together and at the exact same dose time to know really. Or B: you weren't getting enough water for the rate at which the GTE was causing dehydration. That is a noted side effect, especially worsened when you aren't taking it in synergy with the right supplements to increase and accelerate absorption, which supplements are noted in my current (temporary) program thread, but I'll quickly repeat them here: fish oil (or krill or algal, I'm using algal oil now and the synergy is just as good), Vit E, and Vit C. The latter seems more likely.

I'm not saying you ought to try again, just trying to work out what may have happened, since I've already had side effects myself once and worked them out without having to permanently quit taking GTE. I'd hate to have a repeat with some other complication if it had turned out there was no other explanation than dose when I raised my own dose.

For the record, I easily drink well over half a gallon of water a day. Drinking alone my water intake approaches a gallon, and then there's the water content of my food, which is decent as well. So if it was a case of simple dehydration, I'm at very little risk of that myself, I already increased my dose today from 3 capsules containing 600mg EGCg to 5 containing 1 gram EGCg, and tomorrow I'll be going to 6, with 1200mg total EGCg. We'll see if I develop any new complications and what I can do to overcome them if I do. I will say I'm already noticing a case of the jitters, which is likely because my form of the product does not remove enough of the caffeine content. For now, it's just something I'll have to bear with for the first couple hours after my morning dose unless and until I can change product. I haven't experienced caffeine jitters in a LONG time... not since my university days...

[Dana Mantra Eon]

Look at it this way, you googled it, knew what the product was, and asked how I was taking it. Asking what my procedure was. I, on the other hand, didn't know that you googled it, and thought you were asking how I was taking GTE (as in pill form or liquid extract). This seemed like a fair interpretation to me, because there are many "how" questions that are looking for a form, type, or amount response, rather than a procedure ("How would you like your steak cooked?" "How old are you?" "How do you take pm? Pills? Extract? Spray?" etc.)

So when you said "Well obviously" it made me feel judged, like I wasn't at all making a fair interpretation of the question. Frankly, it hurt my feelings. I understand perfectly how you were asking it now, but at the time, do you at all understand how I was seeing it?

As for my experience. Who knows? I certainly haven't taken any fish oil in, um, ten years? I'm not certain as to my vit E intake, and my vitamin C intake has got to be lower these days than it's been in years (went from fruit everyday to... not). I do know for a fact that I wasn't drinking enough water, however, I'm still hesitant to want to try again, since my current herb combo of SP/PM seems to be the only one that's consistently worked for me.

Best of luck upping your dose Abi. Sorry that this has gotten a bit tangled and that I didn't understand your question.

[AbiDrew85]

Look at it this way, you googled it, knew what the product was, and asked how I was taking it. Asking what my procedure was. I, on the other hand, didn't know that you googled it, and thought you were asking how I was taking GTE (as in pill form or liquid extract). This seemed like a fair interpretation to me, because there are many "how" questions that are looking for a form, type, or amount response, rather than a procedure ("How would you like your steak cooked?" "How old are you?" "How do you take pm? Pills? Extract? Spray?" etc.)

So when you said "Well obviously" it made me feel judged, like I wasn't at all making a fair interpretation of the question. Frankly, it hurt my feelings. I understand perfectly how you were asking it now, but at the time, do you at all understand how I was seeing it?

I see what you're saying, though I'm afraid I still don't understand the thought process that led to it. My brain just doesn't work that way... sorry for the confusion and the unintended feelings... I was just trying to get an idea for the variables involved in your experience to know what if anything I could conclude.

As for my experience. Who knows? I certainly haven't taken any fish oil in, um, ten years? I'm not certain as to my vit E intake, and my vitamin C intake has got to be lower these days than it's been in years (went from fruit everyday to... not). I do know for a fact that I wasn't drinking enough water, however, I'm still hesitant to want to try again, since my current herb combo of SP/PM seems to be the only one that's consistently worked for me.

I can understand being hesitant to try again when your prior experience was only negative and you already had found something else that worked well for you. I'm still struggling to get my insanely high T under control. It does sound quite likely that if you had taken it synergistically and drank more water the experience you had may not have occurred, however. I find that encouraging considering I just increased my dose.

Best of luck upping your dose Abi. Sorry that this has gotten a bit tangled and that I didn't understand your question.

Thank you. We'll see how it goes, if it helps any, or causes any problems. When the BF gets the bills caught up from when he was massively underemployed I'm planning to add reishi as well. Alas, I may never get a job myself and be able to really do a proper NBE plan again.

[AlexisM]

I'm using the vitamin shoppe brand of green tea extract:
750 mg
standardized for a min 98% polyphenols and 45% EGCG. LESS THAN .4% caffeine.

Per bottle suggestion I take one per day with the heaviest meal.

I also take SP but at a different time. Haven't noticed any interactions.

[AbiDrew85]

I also take SP but at a different time. Haven't noticed any interactions.

Thanks for the info, Alexis.