[thboy]

I have lurked on this forum and read the articles for several years.  Thank you all for your efforts in telling others how you have made your accomplishments.  Nudist male in the southeast US.  5’-11”, 180#, healthy, 55.  Usually run 3 days per week, about 3.5 miles but have been too busy to run the last year.  I would like my body to appear more feminine/nonbinary when nude.

I would like everyone’s help to learn about NBE, specifically PM, to:
1.  Increase the size of my nipples.
2.  Increase the size of my aerolas to be proportional to my nipples.
3.  Develop visible Montgomery’s glands and also the internal ducts and tissue.
4.  Have a feminine shape to my hips/behind.
5.  I will accept that breast growth will occur but would prefer nothing larger than a well rounded B cup.  I know that genetics are in control here.
6.  I want to maintain my male sexual function.

I am thinking that taking PM to the budding stage and then adding PC would be the proper approach to develop ducts and glandular tissue?  If this concept is correct, would the Amazon bioidentical progesterone cream with the gold label be appropriate?

My nipples have always been prominent to the point that I was self conscious about them as a child.  Certain shirts, one memorable shirt with a logo patch especially, would rub my nipples raw.  I had to lift weights in high school and always thought that caused some chest development.  My nipples have always been sensitive and I have enjoyed having them played with.

My wife and I met a M/F couple during a weeklong stay at a nudist place in 2023.  The male had above average size nipples and aerolas and some breast development.  We talked about his nipples later:

Wife “I wonder if his are as sensitive as yours?”
Me:  “I hope so, it would be a shame otherwise.  I wish mine were at least that large or bigger.”
Wife:  “You want to have female nipples?  How big do you want yours to be?”
Me:  “Not necessary.  Some women have small nipples/aerolas and some have large ones.  Same statement applies to male nipples.  They wouldn’t be female nipples, they would still be my nipples.  His were a nice size, at least that big.”
Wife:  “Hmm.  You can make them bigger if you want.”

I ordered some #4 supplenips but they were not strong enough or large enough.  I also ordered PM capsules from Amazon but only took them for about a week.  I stopped the PM because I developed red dots and a blister while vacuum pumping my penis.  I had been an occasional but experienced pumper for a long time and the red dots and blister had never happened.  The PM was the only unknown so I stopped taking the PM.  Other pumpers have not experienced this while taking PM so I am cautiously planning to restart the PM.

I have used Amazon phytoestrogen cream, with the pink colored label, to lube my nipples for pumping.  I now have a good selection of cups/cylinders for nipple pumping.  My nipples can tolerate a high vacuum level.

My wife asks occasionally but she knows I have been spending my spare time with elderly relatives for the last year.

I have had three laser hair removal appointments as of August 2024.  Was planning to only keep the hair on my upper chest but the technician added the area around my nipples the last time.

Thank you for reading this far.  I know many of my questions have been answered over the years but I would like to ask your help in figuring out what might work best for me.

[Stevenator_]

I'd like to say welcome to another fellow Southern Boy. I'm in the Southeast, too.

I can't offer specific advice on growing your nipples, but many people here use the supple-nips, or the equivalent. Hopefully some of the other members with knowledge in this area will chime in. Mine quadrupled in size when I hit about the 18th month mark when using PM/BO. I was on NBE for about 4.5 years, and then I switched to HRT and I'm almost at the 18th month mark with that now, too.

My areolas also grew in proportion with the size of my nipples, too. I personally attribute this to the use of BO & PC, as I think there are some anecdotal evidence of that affecting their growth. With anything I say here is not advice, but just my experience. There are a few knowledgeable members here on BN, but if you want to know the science behind the things you ask, then I'd say to do a deep dive into the Project-X thread by Lotus. She put an enormous amount of time into sharing her research with us.

If you want Montgomery Glands, then you're going to have to grow breasts. I'd say that a very large percentage of NB/MTF never get beyond a B or C-cup, but I'd also say that if you do, hiding these puppies is very easy to do. However, like you, I used to be a regular at nudist beaches and resorts, but I don't think I'll be going to another one anytime soon. The wife and I do go to the beach every year, and I can get away with laying out and even playing in the surf. I've just got to be stealth about it.

I personally got a huge ass and a pelvic tilt around the 18th month mark when using PM. I had used BO for several months around this time, and it's said to give you nice curves around your hips ass and thighs.

While I should have addressed male function a long time ago, NBE/HRT put my dick in the dirt for several years. Only recently did I start taking Viagra regularly, and it helped. A couple of months ago I started taking 5mg of Cialis daily and holy shit! I stay hard constantly now. That's my personal word of advice there.

When it comes to adding PC, I think it's been said to wait until you reach Tanner Stage one or two, as it could inhibit future growth down the line. After that, bioidentical progesterone without a doubt helps breast growth and overall feminization. Lotus has demonstrated this numerous times with studies posted. It definitely works. As far as PC goes, I believe the brand Lotus used to recommend was Smoky Mountain Naturals. I've used it before and it's very good.

In regards to Phyto/Estrogen Creams go, BioLabs Bi-Est 5.0 actually contains Estradiol. You can get it, and Smoky Mountain Naturals cheaper on eBay vs Amazon. Also, look into the research Lotus posted in the Project-X thread about DHEA Cream. That works, too. It's also cheaper on eBay vs Amazon.

Lastly, I'd personally recommend starting HRT over PM for feminization. I took PM and buckets full of herbs over a 4+ year period and HRT is vastly far and away more better than PM when it comes to achieving your goals. PM is something like less than 10% of the strength of E2. You'll get the results you desire so much faster with HRT vs PM.

Also, HRT is so much easier on your liver than taking tons of weak herbs for years, and your wallet will thank you, too!! Plus, liver health greatly benefits feminization. Active and healthy users have a much higher rate of success than those who don't focus on their physical health. I'm speaking from personal experience. Plus, the science backs this up, too.

Before you get worried, (like I was for years), that HRT means instant transition, don't be afraid. That's not the case. Also, you can do this DIY like I do, too. Just get regular bloodwork done at a local lab. You can check Reddit /TransDIY for advice on how to go about it this way. You don't have to do the insurance thing unless you want to. I'm not sure how things are in your State, but getting HRT prescribed for a "non-binary" is pretty common.

I'm 62 years old, and I still hang out at redneck biker bars drinking beer and such, and I never get a side-eye. Plus, I was a NASCAR photographer for a motorsport magazine, and I'd attend full race weekends at Talladega, Atlanta Motor Speedway, Monster Trucks, Dirt Tracks and you name it, and no one ever looked twice at me. If you want to hide it, you can.

One thing that Lotus once told me really rings true, that starting this process later in life, is that Testosterone has had decades to lock in its effects on our bone structure. This is one reason that younger people have such a higher rate of success with full feminized transition.

I will say that if you continue to progress with E2 Tablets -> Gel -> Injections, then injections are very powerful and it does speed up that process. I started with Tablets for two years and then switched to transdermal gel after that.

Sure, you'll get a softening of your face and friends will marvel that you're getting younger. They'll ask you if you're losing weight etc, but no one will know unless you let them know.

Remember, if you have any specific questions regarding specific topics, do a keyword search in the Project-X thread. At the bottom of each page in each thread on this site, you can search for keyword terms. Chances are, the answers to all your questions are located in the Project-X thread.

Best of Luck to You.

[Heaven's Night]

PM alone, no NBE alone will give you the results HRT can. All NBE programs are typically slower and the changes more subtle, which might be what you're looking for? Conventional HRT is also safer, Stevenator pretty much laid out everything already really well, but I'll give my advice on the list you posted.

I would like everyone’s help to learn about NBE, specifically PM, to:
1.  Increase the size of my nipples.

For this I suggest you use nipple stimulation on the side. PM might help, or might not. I didn't get nearly any nipple development from herbs, only some after starting HRT and the most from lactation + pumping but most of that too has been temporary. I suggest pumps and supple nips and just stimulating them for best results.

2.  Increase the size of my aerolas to be proportional to my nipples.

Might or might not happen, NBE can give you some development, but its likely very little compared to conventional HRT. Slow and subtle is what it'll do, don't expect too much.

3.  Develop visible Montgomery’s glands and also the internal ducts and tissue.

For this you likely have to go on HRT or combine it with NBE methods, again, PM etc. might give you breast tissue development but its likely slow and subtle. This development comes from combined effects of elevated estrogens, progesterone and prolactin mostly, along with growth hormone and bunch of growth factors, without correct hormone balance this will not happen.

4.  Have a feminine shape to my hips/behind.

PM or NBE alone is unlikely to make this happen, Bovine ovary might, but its another gamble on its own. HRT is again the answer to this one, especially combined method program. I did get some fat distribution change before HRT, but it was subtle compared to crazy body changes that happened later. Interestingly, glandular therapy along with HRT and other NBE methods was what absolutely blew up lower body fat distribution to change.

5.  I will accept that breast growth will occur but would prefer nothing larger than a well rounded B cup.  I know that genetics are in control here.

Gene lottery. But getting 1-3 cup sizes isn't something not to expect being possible. Many people have got that or more, I think its great to set goals and hitting B cups is reaslitic, methods which take you there is another question, but its likely doable.

6.  I want to maintain my male sexual function.


Growing breasts requires female hormone balance, or anything that's enough to right direction. You can't have both at the same time, growing boobs is likely to sacrifice some or all function downtown. Boner pills are your friend on this, and so does simple exercise to keep your bits working. Also erection problems might be temporary for the time you're on NBE, but function can fully recover when you stop. Just remember you can't have both full on male function while being on female hormone range for breast development, that's just not how human body works. You can find a balance or do a cycled program to avoid ED and popping pills for it obviously will help.

[tomi66]

Thboy,
I have had good success over the past two years with BO, but it is definitely slow going. Women's jeans fit me, my wife was kind of suprised but I wore them out to dinner last night and they fit great. It is slow going, I am starting to get a little hour glass shape, breasts are less man boobs and more breast looking. As I take off weight while still on BO my shape is getting more defined. And my Cialis works much better now.

Didi and Stevenator,
You two almost have me convinced to start on E with a BO supplement. I am not looking to transition but I like having the female shape.

Stevenator,
Not sure about the DIY approach, maybe I'll DM you if it's ok.

[Stevenator_]

Tomi .... I follow guidelines set forth on the sub-Reddit r/TransDIY. There's a huge amount of info on the menu on that subreddit under the Community Info header. Lots of options to choose from. There's also a r/TransDIY_NonBinary subreddit, too.

In some States, you can access HRT through Planned Parenthood. Dr. Will Powers from Powers Family Medicine is also an option.

Be sure to get your bloodwork done and as always, cross reference the Project-X thread.

Best of Luck to You.

[tomi66]

Thanks, I will check out some of those options.

[OOO]

tomi66

I’ve also wondered about using BO with HRT.  But if you’re not wanting to transition now I would check with Lotus, or some of the veterans as the effects may be greater than you want, as for me it doesn’t matter, except I don’t want to mess up my hormone levels as I’m under DR. care.  Please post what you find out as I would appreciate it.

Caylee

[tomi66]

Caylee,
You're probably right. BO seems to work, slow and steady. HRT will probably speed things up more than I like.