I really love this community! All you guys are so nice and knowledgeable. I love you all! 

I don’t know how I missed all of this. And I’m really surprised to hear PM doesn’t really work. That’s contrary to a lot of what I’ve read on here and other websites.

As for this HRT/NBE combo, that really scares me. I never intended to see a doctor about HRT. Not many people in my life know I’m into this lifestyle, so I’d like to keep it down to just some “gynecomastia.” I don’t want “transitioning” to be on my permanent medical record.

I was just kind of hoping that, with my already low T combined with some natural herbs, for some budding and very small boobs that will definitely be noticeable, but can easily be explained away as aging or a medical condition. Especially since I already had gynecomastia as a teen.

BN is mostly very nice, its diverse and welcoming and there's some really cool knowledgeable people here. That's why I have stuck around, BN is easier for talking about NBE science than most trans communities and I like it how we're such mixed bunch and I'm here to catch any closeted trans women looking for support and help with hormone sorcery.

PM does work, but its slow and not really super duper awesome and it has blood clotting risk which has been unfortunately proven the dangerous way several times. I'm one of those who got DVT symptoms from it.

Not many are, to guys this is probably a life style, for me its a life and death, do or die situation and I'm very enthusiastic about what makes boobs happen. And full body feminisation in general, this obviously is a huge interest because I'm a transsexual (with build in weirdness of intersex condition.) woman and I'm not loaded with money so what ever I can do outside of plastic surgery is a huge win and that's where BN forum is invaluable information asset. Me and many others here are our own endocrinologists dictated by life situation, DIY hormone treatment is a viable path and very useful for men wanting to grow boobs and get feminine fat distribution. Its nothing to be scared of, there's plenty of information on how it works and how it can be cheaply and efficiently done. Finding a golden middle with dosages also allows the changes to be gradual and slow, I repeat that its never instant and never crazy dramatic. Anyway, worth looking into and considering depending on your needs.

Also don'tworry about growing boobs, you can have a LOT and it still can be played down as gynecomastia very easily. The condition is so typical for guys who wont get any kind of "suspicion" about their gender regardless of sporting quite a lot of boobs, you'll be fine. Ask Stevenator about that. If that big tits fly under the radar when needed, you have nothing to worry about. You can have very androgynous body shape without it being weird.

When I was beginning my transition, I was already wearing was it 34F bra and people couldn't tell. And I've never been masculine looking much at all, except maybe for height and I was quite buffed out +5 years ago. But all that natural androgyny and quite a bit of boobs and wider than normal hips was completely invisible for quite some time. Its really crazy how peoples gender perception works. As long as they think they're dealing with a man, they see a man, even if there's a lot of obviously feminine traits.

Yeah, I really like it here. This place is great. I have noticed people on other sites are very selfish and condescending. They don’t want to reveal any information and won’t believe anything you say. They think you’re only there to troll them and stir up crap. So if you haven’t been with them for years, they just shut you out, like you’re supposed to prove yourself and earn their trust first. Like some kind of sorority. 

Well now you guys got me scared of PM, too LOL What are the symptoms of DVT? I certainly don’t want any health issues as I’ve been very lucky. I’ve been healthy as a race horse all my life and don’t take any medications. I’ve always been very active even to this day. My job keeps me on my feet all day (about 15,000 steps daily) I skateboard, run and rollerblade a lot. I also workout to keep somewhat toned.

I know there’s risks in everything, I’m willing to take some, but not if they’re gonna have a serious effect on my health. If that’s the case, I may unfortunately have to abandon this plan. I guess I was just hoping there was a way to “induce” gynecomastia without any serious side effects or involving a lot of money or doctors.

Think about my suggestion, it isn't expensive.
A Vial of EEn , 50 €, Last for 15 months and the NBE Stuff is even great for healthy living, 
The risk doing something bad is less, your Body tells you the direction.
Go Into it and make your decision when you will reach your Goals...
You will regret it later not trying,cause there are ever thoughts in your head...

I definitely don’t want any regrets, either. I’m not too good at googling things. I always seem to get way off track LOL Where do I find this stuff? You mention “vial,” does it come in another way other than an injectable? Also, I’m in the USA, does that make a difference?

Yeah, I really like it here. This place is great. I have noticed people on other sites are very selfish and condescending. They don’t want to reveal any information and won’t believe anything you say. They think you’re only there to troll them and stir up crap. So if you haven’t been with them for years, they just shut you out, like you’re supposed to prove yourself and earn their trust first. Like some kind of sorority. 

Well now you guys got me scared of PM, too LOL What are the symptoms of DVT? I certainly don’t want any health issues as I’ve been very lucky. I’ve been healthy as a race horse all my life and don’t take any medications. I’ve always been very active even to this day. My job keeps me on my feet all day (about 15,000 steps daily) I skateboard, run and rollerblade a lot. I also workout to keep somewhat toned.

I know there’s risks in everything, I’m willing to take some, but not if they’re gonna have a serious effect on my health. If that’s the case, I may unfortunately have to abandon this plan. I guess I was just hoping there was a way to “induce” gynecomastia without any serious side effects or involving a lot of money or doctors.

BN is usually very open minded place and cool with newbies. We don't have some crazy dumb fuck pecking order here, other than you'll soon learn who the veterans are and what are the threads of greatest interest and greatest information. I guess its our diversity here which is keeping cliques from forming. And here all information is free to access, all you need is to find everything.

PM is quite problematic on the DVT thing, not everybody has gotten that, but many enough so that I would rather pick another route instead. For me the symptoms were nighly super painful aches in my legs, somewhere bit above my knee typically. It was awful, as soon as I took a break from PM and later switched on HRT, all symptoms disappeared. Note that I smoked back then and I have naturally extremely thick blood. Which is great, I don't bleed to death very easily, but I have to watch my life style and habits to avoid blood clots.

Being active at work and hobbies is really awesome, that will help with breast development too as that keeps your growth hormone levels high. For your age of course as those levels slowly diminish after about thirty years. (This ties in with the HGH + IGF-1 + HGF route of growth which is very important.)

You can look into other NBE items out there, or consider HRT to help with it, that's the only guaranteed way to this really. EVerything else will be slower and less dramatic and probably not going to give you full development.

About finding DIY HRT, go to reddid. r/estrogel and r/DIYHRT are good places to start. There are pills, gel, patches and injections as the most common methods, injection wins hands down, gel is maybe second best, pills are ok, but might push blood clotting risk, patch is stable but expensive and might be hard to get.

I think not...
Google for HRT Cafe ( HRT Cafe.net )
Good Luck...
You can ask everytime, but be patienced with my poor english please 

You can ask me too if you need help... I will not disclose HRT sources on a public forum, but private messages are there for that.

I think not...
Google for HRT Cafe ( HRT Cafe.net )
Good Luck...
You can ask everytime, but be patienced with my poor english please 

Don’t worry about your English ? Thank you so much! I will definitely look into this. I did do some googling and found a website called Folx Health. I have no idea if they’re legit, I’ve never heard of them before nor have I seen anyone speak of them on here, so not sure if they’re safe. But yeah, that’s all I could find.

Think about my suggestion, it isn't expensive.
A Vial of EEn , 50 €, Last for 15 months and the NBE Stuff is even great for healthy living, 
The risk doing something bad is less, your Body tells you the direction.
Go Into it and make your decision when you will reach your Goals...
You will regret it later not trying,cause there are ever thoughts in your head...

I wanna say that its quite possible they wouldn't regret not trying it and they shouldn't feel pressure to hurry while they have time. though i will say starting in one's 40s is a great deal better than starting in ones 50s.

But yeah, Estradiol will always have a fair amount fewer side effects. PM has a risk of DVT, though if you live actively and eat well your risk is quite low at reasonable doses. the claims the BO does like irreparable feminization is mostly false, some people have significant effects far beyond what they initially planned and some people get nothing at all. The only permanent thing about it is that it might hang around in fat or something for a bit longer than some other source. So it's not like a one-way train to girl town, it's a car that's due for new brake pads, and the variance is how fast the car goes. Estradiol is def very controllable and its very strong.

-Aria

Very well expressed Aria...

Welcome SlimSkatey,
When I started this journey a few years ago I read multiple strings on the forum trying to figure out what to route i wanted to take. Like you, I am not interested in transition, I already have natural breast growth, very little body hair and love dressing feminine, I wanted more feminine breasts and if the feminine features came with it that was a a bonus.

I stayed away from PM because of the risk of DVT and went straight to BO and a few accompanying supplements. I did that for 2 years with good results, I grew 2 cup sizes and a little fat distribution. At the end of 2 years I really liked the feminine shape that was starting to take place but I was spending a lot on BO and other supporting supplements, so after some thought I did a some research on E and decided to take the plunge.

I found an online service called Folx who serve all 50 united states and have doctors and it is all done via video visit, they take certain insurance in most states, and will prescribe medication to your pharmacy, mine are covered under my insurance, if you don't have insurance most pharmacies have discount cards.

I understand that E sounds like a bridge too far but it's really not. I like that it's much cheaper, does the same thing but quicker and more efficiently. The problem with PM and BO is they don't work for everyone.

Thought I would share some insight on my experience, since it sounds like we are in a similar situation.