[aleah]

Hi,

I signed up to post this hoping it can help others and to thank others for their advice too! I first came upon PM and SP for my transition here and am very happy I did.

I like to research anything in depth and as a PhD student I am used to reading a lot of very dry research papers. So when I was buying SP one day, I found a lot of the "prostate health" complexes had Pygeum in it. After some research I had found out that Pygeum is starting to be recommended ahead of and in combination with Saw Palmetto in almost all cases of benign prostatic hyperplasia.

Well here is the cliffs for anyone thats interested about Pygeum and why I added it to my routine of SP and PM.

What does Saw Palmetto actually do?
The two main suspected mechanisms of action are:

1) Inhibition of both forms of 5-alpha-reductase. Which leads to "inhibition of 5-alpha-reductase results in decreased production of DHT, increased levels of testosterone, and, perhaps, increased levels of estradiol."

DHT is a stronger form of testosterone and responsible for many masculine features, and male disorders like BPH and baldness. So SPs many function is to inhibit a metabolite that leads to the reduction of DHT. This mechanism has been researched well.

2) Interfering with DHT binding to the androgen receptor.

This has been proposed but not researched heavily. This would just further interfere with DHT's effects on the body.

What does Pygeum do and why is it different?
Pygeum africanum contains an antiandrogenic compound atraric acid...
Pygeum africanum revealed the highest antiandrogenic effect...
Of this extract led to the isolation of N-butylbenzenesulfonamide (NBBS) indicating that extracts of the stem bark of Pygeum africanum harbour androgen antagonistic activity.

Unlike the proposed mechanism of SP of binding to the androgen receptor, according to several studies it seems that Pygeum has a well known antiandrogenic effect by binding to the androgen receptor and shows effective results in treating BPH and consistent and significant reduction of DHT.

So how does this actually help me?
Well whether they have similar mechanisms or different mechanisms, they both help greatly reduce DHT and possibly even testosterone after a while. Normally in MtF HRT they also administer an anti-androgen (because testosterone is an androgen) so Pygeum (in combination with the already proven SP) can act as this and hopefully produce a better result.

Conclusion/my thoughts
I've started using it after 2 months of SP + PM and hoping it just helps reduce DHT/T in my body even more than normally and possibly leading to better NBE/feminizing results.

Anyone else have experience with Pygeum?

[Brigitte]

Wow, that's really interesting, very much appreciate you sharing your research. Would love to hear how you get on as the Pygeum kicks in to your program.

[TibetanPrincess]

Hi,

I signed up to post this hoping it can help others and to thank others for their advice too! I first came upon PM and SP for my transition here and am very happy I did.

I like to research anything in depth and as a PhD student I am used to reading a lot of very dry research papers. So when I was buying SP one day, I found a lot of the "prostate health" complexes had Pygeum in it. After some research I had found out that Pygeum is starting to be recommended ahead of and in combination with Saw Palmetto in almost all cases of benign prostatic hyperplasia.

Well here is the cliffs for anyone thats interested about Pygeum and why I added it to my routine of SP and PM.

What does Saw Palmetto actually do?
The two main suspected mechanisms of action are:

1) Inhibition of both forms of 5-alpha-reductase. Which leads to "inhibition of 5-alpha-reductase results in decreased production of DHT, increased levels of testosterone, and, perhaps, increased levels of estradiol."

DHT is a stronger form of testosterone and responsible for many masculine features, and male disorders like BPH and baldness. So SPs many function is to inhibit a metabolite that leads to the reduction of DHT. This mechanism has been researched well.

2) Interfering with DHT binding to the androgen receptor.

This has been proposed but not researched heavily. This would just further interfere with DHT's effects on the body.

What does Pygeum do and why is it different?
Pygeum africanum contains an antiandrogenic compound atraric acid...
Pygeum africanum revealed the highest antiandrogenic effect...
Of this extract led to the isolation of N-butylbenzenesulfonamide (NBBS) indicating that extracts of the stem bark of Pygeum africanum harbour androgen antagonistic activity.

Unlike the proposed mechanism of SP of binding to the androgen receptor, according to several studies it seems that Pygeum has a well known antiandrogenic effect by binding to the androgen receptor and shows effective results in treating BPH and consistent and significant reduction of DHT.

So how does this actually help me?
Well whether they have similar mechanisms or different mechanisms, they both help greatly reduce DHT and possibly even testosterone after a while. Normally in MtF HRT they also administer an anti-androgen (because testosterone is an androgen) so Pygeum (in combination with the already proven SP) can act as this and hopefully produce a better result.

Conclusion/my thoughts



Anyone else have experience with Pygeum?

I have used both pyg bark and white Peony together with success. I have no test now and I am going to build healthy T levels from scratch!

I had a problem with my estros converting into androgens. So this has helped my acne tremendously.

[mady]

I'm using a high dose of pygeum in my morning intake dose
And sp for my midday and night dose . Working great for me !

[aoz]

I've been using pygeum with saw palmetto for a couple of months now, relying more on the pygeum. They've definitely helped block androgenic effects and helped me get better results from Pueraria Mirifica

[Lenneth]

I've never tried or really known about pygeum, I wonder if it lacks the anti-prolactin properties that SP has..

[aleah]

Just an update, I've been trying to find Pygeum on it's own (I hate complex giant pills full of tiny amounts of other stuff thats mostly ineffective) but several of the more pure ones (Pygeum, SP) contain also Willowherb, in particular, Epilobium parviflorum.

Be warned, while it does also inhibit the same metabolite as SP to reduce DHT. It is ALSO an amaratose inhibitor which inhibits the conversion of testosterone to Estradiol in both men and women.

[AbiDrew85]

Just an update, I've been trying to find Pygeum on it's own (I hate complex giant pills full of tiny amounts of other stuff thats mostly ineffective) but several of the more pure ones (Pygeum, SP) contain also Willowherb, in particular, Epilobium parviflorum.

Be warned, while it does also inhibit the same metabolite as SP to reduce DHT. It is ALSO an amaratose inhibitor which inhibits the conversion of testosterone to Estradiol in both men and women.

Which makes sense for a product being marketed to men with prostate problems due to excess testosterone. They want to block off the T, yes, but they don't want to increase the E.

A product containing an aromatase inhibitor is perfect for them.

[JustEmily]

Sorry to dredge up an old thread, but I am taking PM with Pygeum. (can't take SP due to a drug interaction)

Do you think this would make progress slower? I know that PM mimics the E, but I still need some natural E in my system, right?

[tanysquirrel]

*bump*

anyone still using pygeum? if so, how is it going, any further updates/progress?

curious