[sfem]

This topic comes up from time to time and in the process of looking for papers on another topic, I came across this one which is interesting in my opinion. I'm no scientist and I was wondering what those with real credentials and actual medical training think of this paper's conclusions. Anybody care to take it on?

http://endo.endojournals.org/content/148/2/538.abstract
- "... Our results demonstrate that herbal ERβ-selective estrogens may be a safer alternative for hormone therapy than estrogens that nonselectively activate both ER subtypes. "

[bryony]

I'm not qualified, but here is a different paper with similar conclusions:
http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/art...220700240X

[bryony]

This one shows evidence that it actually helps to destroy tumor cells!

http://www.onius.net/downloads/EMM037-02-06.pdf

[chrishoney]

i do remember reading studies of PM that showed it did NOT have the same cell proliferative effects as estradiol with certain breast cancer cell lines, while other studies showed it did not cause the same kinds of pre-cancerous changes to the cervix compared to estradiol. The above studies are all new to me, but here are some I came across recently regarding PM and carcinogenicity (a search on carcinogenesis yields similar results): http://scholar.google.com/scholar?hl=en&as_sdt=0,39&q=pueraria+mirifica+%2B+carcinogenicity

The upshot seems to be: you can't assume that PM has the same effects on estrogen-sensitive breast cancer (or other cancers) just because it has other estrogenic effects on the body. And for some cancer cell lines, it had a protective or inhibitory effect when tested in vitro (in cell cultures in a lab.)

The folks over at DIYHormone group on yahoo are in the process of dis'ing PM at the moment and at Susans.org ALL posts that contain personal testimony to the effectiveness of PM will be deleted without warning, and I assume the poster will be reprimanded if not outright banned. LOL! Guess the traditional medical establishment aren't the only ones with blinders on.

[Lenneth]

Nothing new with Susans, they ban anyone for being outside of their "Very" small Box....

Sad really, because they do a lot of harm being like that, they behave no better than that troll we had in here the other week when you stop and think about it.

[bryony]

...at Susans.org ALL posts that contain personal testimony to the effectiveness of PM will be deleted without warning, and I assume the poster will be reprimanded if not outright banned. LOL! Guess the traditional medical establishment aren't the only ones with blinders on.

I have totally given up on Susan's "House of Correction"... they can stew in their self-satisfaction.

They have a non-op board with people suffering from their GD symptoms and I posted about how PM helped me.

They deleted it and accused me of being a spammer, which is ridiculous. If there were only one company selling it, maybe, but you need to mention a vendor to be a spammer. You can't even link to other sites!

I've copied an email extract below for your amusement.

It seems that you can only be a "real" TS if you can exhibit symptoms of PMS!

B.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
On Sat, Jun 23, 2012 at 12:06 PM, Susan Larson wrote:

I will unblock you, however you are not permitted to advocate for Pueraria Mirifica on my site. That includes linking to pages which do. Is this understood?
------
On 6/24/12, Susan Larson wrote:
> The problem is your posts smell like posting for financial gain and it's
> a common spammer tactic. You have only been allowed back because I can't
> 100% prove that your posts were commercial in nature, but I go with my
> gut. I found a series of posts like yours all from people with 1-2 posts
> so I have removed them all. Your continued access to the site is
> conditional on your not posting testimonials for this herb or any other;
> good bad or ugly. The Staff have been instructed to delete on sight any
> posts about this herb which appear to be testimonial in nature from anyone.
>
> Specific justification for this action is contained in full or part in
> Rules 1, 3, 8A, and 13.

[flamesabers]

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
On Sat, Jun 23, 2012 at 12:06 PM, Susan Larson wrote:

I will unblock you, however you are not permitted to advocate for Pueraria Mirifica on my site. That includes linking to pages which do. Is this understood?
------
On 6/24/12, Susan Larson wrote:
> Specific justification for this action is contained in full or part in
> Rules 1, 3, 8A, and 13.

Now I truly understand why you call it "Susan's House of Correction."

Referencing rules like really makes her sound like a corrections officer.

You don't suppose she's one in real life.....

[AbiDrew85]

And you people wonder why I hang around here instead of going to those places... At least you lot try to give equal value to all the theories, even if my theories are largely conjecture based and not yet proven... Some here, granted, take everything I say as though it were absolute fact, but they really shouldn't, no one here I don't think is qualified to be giving out facts. Least of all me.

I also hang around Big Closet for my other needs... though they aren't particularly open to ANY kind of DIY there. Granted, the sites primary point of existence is for stories, and blogs and forums are meant more as an extension for discussion of those and not really for anything else.