[frontier]

If any of this scares you, you may want to rethink things. If it excites you in any way, then go for it.

The answer is both fear AND excitement. I also question why the desire to feminize has surged in the past year after being dormant for a long time.

From your description, it sounds as if PM could push me over the proverbial edge even if I don't grow obvious boobs. Great even more to ponder. How can an herb cause so much angst?

[SarahSchilling]

The answer is both fear AND excitement. I also question why the desire to feminize has surged in the past year after being dormant for a long time.

From your description, it sounds as if PM could push me over the proverbial edge even if I don't grow obvious boobs. Great even more to ponder. How can an herb cause so much angst?

I'd say excitement always trumps fear, and you're only going to torture yourself by trying to anticipate its effects rather than trying it.

That's just how I felt when I joined this forum though. You should treasure the way you feel about taking the plunge. Thinking back to when NBE was new makes me smile nostalgically.

Honestly, if you were happy with yourself all jacked up on testosterone, you wouldn't be here. If you end up sliding down the slope, it's because the desire to do so already existed within you, not because of the herb itself imo.

Good luck either way though!

Fuck, it sounds like I'm trying to talk you into taking it. I'm not, my views on the subject are purely anecdotal, and the result of the positive effects its had on me. Sorry about that.

[AnnieBL]

In living with my own gender variance, I have realised that I found various ways to sublimate or use it in order to make life tolerable. One of these has been travel - travel for its own sake, to travel is more important than to arrive. One form of travel is one's journey through life, and for me NBE has been a fascinating, illuminating and life changing journey. I did not set out to affect my mind, but it has been, and I am glad.

I am not certain whether PM has been the main factor, or the apparently permanent loss of testosterone production caused by prescription pharmaceuticals, or both. Either way, PM is very satisfactory and apparently safe HRT. Sex change fantasies gave way to seeking some discrete and modest feminisation that I could easily hide, and I hadn't really bargained for drug induced complete loss of normal male function and extreme atrophy of male parts, but now I am glad of my breast development and don't really care if it does show: but I intend to continue presenting as male: my family situation and my relationship with my wife are still stronger influences.

So, Frontier, you are on the edge of starting a journey which may take you I know not where, but I hope that if you take the plunge you end up rejoicing that you took it.

[flamesabers]

From your description, it sounds as if PM could push me over the proverbial edge even if I don't grow obvious boobs. Great even more to ponder. How can an herb cause so much angst?

The possibility of NBE herbs pushing one to transition is controversial. I'm of the opinion that pm doesn't make you do anything that you wouldn't already want to do. There are some members who have gone on to transitioning after starting on NBE herbs, while others have been on such herbs for years and have no plans for transitioning. For the former group, I suppose NBE herbs is but a taste of how much happier they'll be by transitioning. With the latter group, I think the use of NBE herbs satisfies gender dysphoria and that's the stopping point for them.

Honestly, if you were happy with yourself all jacked up on testosterone, you wouldn't be here.

Good point Sarah. I often overlook this in favor of advising new members to be cautious when considering NBE.

[GoneGirl]

From your description, it sounds as if PM could push me over the proverbial edge even if I don't grow obvious boobs. Great even more to ponder. How can an herb cause so much angst?

We shouldn't overlook the option of working with a good therapist. Talking with a gender specialist can help clarify your gender identity confusion. The therapist's first task will be to help you to know yourself better, and suggest a course of action.

Frontier, I don't know you, of course, but I sense that you are very conflicted about what to do. That tells me that you need to take more time to figure things out before jumping into any experimentation with hormones.

My gender issues came on suddenly, too. I then spent several weeks reading about gender identity dysphoria. I found Jack Molay's website, crossdreamers.com, about crossdreamers extremely helpful in my getting a handle on my problems. If interested, here's a good place to start:

http://www.crossdreamers.com/2008/01/rea...ns-of.html

CK

[frontier]

Frontier, I don't know you, of course, but I sense that you are very conflicted about what to do. That tells me that you need to take more time to figure things out before jumping into any experimentation with hormones.

My gender issues came on suddenly, too. I then spent several weeks reading about gender identity dysphoria. I found Jack Molay's website, crossdreamers.com, about crossdreamers extremely helpful in my getting a handle on my problems. If interested, here's a good place to start:

http://www.crossdreamers.com/2008/01/rea...ns-of.html

CK

As for seeing a therapist, I always though that was for men who felt they were actually women trapped in a man's body. Me, I know am I man, I have just always fantasized about being a woman.

But it was always too complicated/expensive to contemplate doing anything about it. That's why reading about PM has made me so conflicted. It's neither complicated nor expensive. Take an herbal supplement twice a day and some aspects of your long held fantasies might become a reality? That prospect is both insanely attractive and scary. As they say, be careful what you wish for. And don't all those movies involving magic and wishes always end up bad for the wishers?

Anyway thanks for letting me ramble. I have no idea what I'll do, but it surprises me to realize that I want to experience the effects of PM enough to seriously consider trying it, despite the possibility of irreversible changes.

That crossdreamers sight is interesting. I didn't realize so much thought and discussion had gone into this topic!

[GoneGirl]

As for seeing a therapist, I always though that was for men who felt they were actually women trapped in a man's body. Me, I know am I man, I have just always fantasized about being a woman.

Yeah, Frontier, we are both crossdreamers, just enough female in our makeup to screw us up big time.

I decided not to see a therapist also due to the cost involved and not knowing how to find a good one. I did get a copy of "The Gendered Self" by Dr. Anne Vitale. It was very informative. She subscribes to the theory that your gender identity is established after conception while the brain is developing in the womb under the influence of hormones produced by both mother and fetus. An insufficient amount of testosterone can produce a female gendered brain to a greater or lesser extent. For those of us who are neither male nor female gender dominant, life can be quite difficult. God, I wish I had know about this stuff when I was a young man.

BTW, I watched a French (English subtitles) movie last night called "Lawrence Anyways". It's about a man in his mid-thirties who decides to transition to live as a woman. His wife has a hell of time accepting it. As trans movies go it was better than most. Not the typical Hollywood stereo typing of transsexual women. I also liked "Red Without Blue", a documentary about the lives of identical twin boys one gay and the other transsexual.

CK

[sfem]

If you liked Lawrence Anyways, go find a copy of Trans-sister Radio. Somewhat different story line, but I like how it reveals the multiple viewpoints on the process. Fair warning, it will throw mud into your water with respect to deciding if this is for you.

[GoneGirl]

If you liked Lawrence Anyways, go find a copy of Trans-sister Radio. Somewhat different story line, but I like how it reveals the multiple viewpoints on the process. Fair warning, it will throw mud into your water with respect to deciding if this is for you.

I think "Trans-sister Radio" is a book, right? Is there a movie, too?

Ck

[JustEmily]

I am in month 8 of my NBE experience, and let me tell you, I fell like a different person since I began.

I used to be cranky, depressed and borderline paranoid. Hated my job, hated everything. Chalked it all up to being a disgruntled ugly cross-dresser with a bad bout of GID. Almost drove my car into the frozen waters of lake Erie last year at this time.

Found this fourm... lurked for a while, then ordered some PM.

Within a few weeks, I had the standard newbie reaction "my gawd, I'm SMOOTH, I think I'm growing... wowza!"

Then the mental part started kicking in. I cried. Let me tell you, I'm 42, I hadn't done that in about 20 years.

And that was just the beginning. I feel more patient, less angry (but still sort of angry when I cant find size 13 shoes at PayLess that are within my budget). I found the courage to reorganize things in my life that had lay dormant for almost ten years. I am painting again and I laugh.

I have had physical changes, although mine seem to be focused on my hips and backside. I have mentioned before that NBE for me seems to mean natural butt enhancement. I now have an hourglass figure. No kidding. Smallish breast growth, but hey... I can be hippy.

I take between 2000 and 3000 per day depending on how I have been tolerating it (i get headaches if i take too much) but that is usually countered nicely by a dab of progesterone cream on the wrists.

My wife is very pleased, and I think finally gets the GID thing is not just me being a perv. but a genuine brain wiring thing. PM gives me what I need.

These herbs have been a lifesaver for me.