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Why is it that everytime i take 2 pm pills from ainterol along with 2 SP pills everyday then after about 1 week 1/2 to 2 weeks I get a really bad headache and nauseated?? Is it estrogen dominance?? Is PM just not agreeing with me? (Granted I do have bad allergies)
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07-01-2013, 06:56 AM
(This post was last modified: 07-01-2013, 06:58 AM by
BonitaDDs.)
Try lower dose I had funny symptom include bad headach when using 2 ainterol capsual then I dropped to 1 at night and went away as well I got my biggest growth around time of lowering dose so its for sure good thing to try first.
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I had an aura migraine yesterday after taking 2sp with 2-3 pm 2x daily. This happened to me last year as well. I dont think it was happening when i took the pm without any sp, but there are so many other factors involved as well like what i ate i could have been having a high sugar attack i don't really know.
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The combo of SP and PM don't at all surprise me. I think you got hit with a double whammy of estrogen all at once.
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(07-01-2013, 09:57 PM)tibetan113 Wrote: The combo of SP and PM don't at all surprise me. I think you got hit with a double whammy of estrogen all at once.
SP is NOT a phytoestrogen containing herb.
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I added in a Progesterone cream the other night and I didn't get the headache and nausea. Whatever happened before though really really sucked. My head was THROBBING!
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08-01-2013, 01:27 AM
(This post was last modified: 08-01-2013, 01:29 AM by
TibetanPrincess.)
(07-01-2013, 11:24 PM)chrishoney Wrote: (07-01-2013, 09:57 PM)tibetan113 Wrote: The combo of SP and PM don't at all surprise me. I think you got hit with a double whammy of estrogen all at once.
SP is NOT a phytoestrogen containing herb.
Lol, I never SAID that. It somehow brings the estrogen up by not allowing E to turn into a type of androgen. Therefore its like getting a another load of estrogen when they could have been on their way to androgen city. Why else would one's ass get fatter. It happened to me. I get estrogen dominant like symptoms and notice my thighs and ass are bigger than ever and that = estrogen.
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ct23,
The same thing happened to me and I did two things. First, you may want to spread out the PM and take one pill every 4 hours or so. And the progesterone cream helped me a lot. I was getting a headache that I could not get rid of until I began the PC. I even stopped the PC and the headaches returned and went away after beginning on the PC again. And as others have suggested, you may want to lower the dose a bit if the PC does not continue to prevent headaches. These types of headaches are really nasty and pain medication did not provide me with much relief.
Good luck with whatever you decide to do!
KellyG
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08-01-2013, 05:37 PM
(This post was last modified: 08-01-2013, 05:45 PM by
chrishoney.)
(08-01-2013, 01:27 AM)tibetan113 Wrote: Lol, I never SAID that. It somehow brings the estrogen up by not allowing E to turn into a type of androgen. Therefore its like getting a another load of estrogen when they could have been on their way to androgen city. Why else would one's ass get fatter. It happened to me. I get estrogen dominant like symptoms and notice my thighs and ass are bigger than ever and that = estrogen.
Sorry, but this is just as incorrect as your first statement regarding a double dose of estrogen. There is NO enzymatic pathway to convert estradiol or any other form of estrogen into any kind of androgen. It simply does not happen. The conversion of testosterone to estradiol via the aromatase enzymatic pathway is one way. It is not reversible. Therefore, SP can not increase estrogen levels by your proposed mechanism.
There is speculation (perhaps hope is a better word) that by inhibiting the conversion of T to DHT via 5-alpha reductase (this is all that SP does) the increased T (that is no longer converted) will be aromatized to estradiol. Without something else to alter the normal hormone levels the body tries to maintain (such as coleus forskolii which is said to increase aromatase activity), in all likelihood, the feedback mechanisms between the pituitary and gonads will reduce T production long before significant amounts of estradiol are produced. (You can check the enzymatic pathways of steroidogenesis in humans in the diagram near the bottom of this page:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Testosterone)
Again, in my opinion, this is in contradiction to your original statement of receiving an effective double dose of estrogen.
I would venture that the doubling effect you felt Tibetan is more because you have high levels of endogenous estradiol to begin with, while the OP and most of the rest of us do not.
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(08-01-2013, 05:37 PM)chrishoney Wrote: (08-01-2013, 01:27 AM)tibetan113 Wrote: Lol, I never SAID that. It somehow brings the estrogen up by not allowing E to turn into a type of androgen. Therefore its like getting a another load of estrogen when they could have been on their way to androgen city. Why else would one's ass get fatter. It happened to me. I get estrogen dominant like symptoms and notice my thighs and ass are bigger than ever and that = estrogen.
Sorry, but this is just as incorrect as your first statement regarding a double dose of estrogen. There is NO enzymatic pathway to convert estradiol or any other form of estrogen into any kind of androgen. It simply does not happen. The conversion of testosterone to estradiol via the aromatase enzymatic pathway is one way. It is not reversible. Therefore, SP can not increase estrogen levels by your proposed mechanism.
There is speculation (perhaps hope is a better word) that by inhibiting the conversion of T to DHT via 5-alpha reductase (this is all that SP does) the increased T (that is no longer converted) will be aromatized to estradiol. Without something else to alter the normal hormone levels the body tries to maintain (such as coleus forskolii which is said to increase aromatase activity), in all likelihood, the feedback mechanisms between the pituitary and gonads will reduce T production long before significant amounts of estradiol are produced. (You can check the enzymatic pathways of steroidogenesis in humans in the diagram near the bottom of this page: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Testosterone)
Again, in my opinion, this is in contradiction to your original statement of receiving an effective double dose of estrogen.
I would venture that the doubling effect you felt Tibetan is more because you have high levels of endogenous estradiol to begin with, while the OP and most of the rest of us do not.
Well however SP works is of course a mystery to me. There are at least a hundred properties in that one herb alone. There is probably more to it than what is well known. I have taken it off and on and always notice larger lips, bigger hips and thighs, more cellulite. My problem was actually high DHEA. So I took it and got my androgens down. At the time and I did get headaches every now and again while on SP.
So you cannot just assume all is known about SP or that the headaches came from PM. It also could have been the liver not flushing hormone like substances out properly.
