[Beverley50]

Hi all,

This is my first post. I'm Beverley, currently in MTF transition.

I have been contemplating going the HRT route through a new doctor (my old one won't understand, and I'm a bit embarrassed to talk to him about it) but since this will open up a whole variety of issues like psychological evaluations, shrink visits, family involvement etc I have decided that I will try and go the herbal route first. I have done a LOT of reading about the subject and have come across 2 seemingly major proponents, namely fenugreek and saw palmetto, that could be taken together. I have decided to put saw palmetto on the back-burner for now since there are such opposing reports about it's effect, some saying it will have an effect on blocking (to a degree) the production of DHT, improving hair growth, skin tone, and the production of estrogen etc. Other say that it has exactly the opposite effect, that it blocks the production of estrogen. So it is all so confusing that I have put it aside until I can find more meaningful and precise data.

So, I have been taking Fenugreek in pill form three times a day, 1000mg (2 tabs), for a total of 3000mg per day, over a period of 2 months now. And the effect upon my boobs have been wonderful. I have had a little fat around my entire body for many years and I have always been slim, never overweight. I don't have very tight skin (I have been told that larger breast implants will work very well with my skin type) but I have grown into a full a-cup within an 8-week period (I can barely cup each breast with my hand. I have also become aware that the breast tissue (fat) has even spread to areas under my armpits. I notice this every time when I move either arm across my body, and I feel the new bulge press against my upper arm. It is such a pleasurable feminine feeling, something that I only now realize how I've missed it all my life. I have also become aware that my areolas have increased a little in size to around 1 inch, but the major difference has been in their change of color, from pink to a much darker reddish-brown. Very noticeable. And my nipples are so much more sensitive.

And NO, I am NOT imagining this. It is real, as real as this message is. I know my body well and I know what it looked like before. I have read about the dramatic effects of phyto-estrogens upon some people, and not on others, but I am over the moon about my personal experience . . . . so far!

If there is anyone out there with meaningful additional information, please share it with me.

[michelle street]

The only meaningful information I can give you and you may already know this is that you can't stop the smell it gives you in your groin mainly and still take the supplement fenugreek ,and when you do stop the effects go away including smell and growth,I took it for 9-10 months and the growth was not enough to justify the smell, have you looked into Swanson bovine glandular supplements?

[VergeOfDiscovery]

I've recently experimented with applying (bit of massage) some 3 to 1 liquid extract I already had sitting around (instead of ingesting it) before bed (overnight) and have liked the results - and without having the fennugreek smell permeating one's being all day, during the day.

[Beverley50]

I have that maple syrup smell in my urine when I pee yes, but maybe I'm lucky, because I do not have any additional personal smells or body odors. I have actually asked a few personal friends and family about it, and even to smell my skin close up, and no-one has confirmed any odors, even when it is hot.

So although it is a common harmless side effect of fenugreek use, I am unaffected by it. Maple syrup isn't that bad a smell in your urine, and its only evident a few times a day anyway. It's a tiny price to pay for having boobs

[Beverley50]

The only meaningful information I can give you and you may already know this is that you can't stop the smell it gives you in your groin mainly and still take the supplement fenugreek ,and when you do stop the effects go away including smell and growth,I took it for 9-10 months and the growth was not enough to justify the smell, have you looked into Swanson bovine glandular supplements?

No, I have never heard of it, but thanks for the link!   Reading right now! VERY interesting indeed!

[Beverley50]

I've recently experimented with applying (bit of massage) some 3 to 1 liquid extract I already had sitting around (instead of ingesting it) before bed (overnight) and have liked the results - and without having the fennugreek smell permeating one's being all day, during the day.

I massage around 15 minutes in the morning and 15 at bedtime, using a good tissue oil. Then I also massage during the day, at random, when I have a quiet time alone. Then I massage under my top, but over my t-shirt or vest, that covers my sports bra. I wear these permanently now. They're Nike, wireless, and there's no telltale clips on your back.

I am of the opinion that massaging and stimulating breasts are of utmost importance, and breast growth is surely going to benefit from it.

[Beverley50]

The only meaningful information I can give you and you may already know this is that you can't stop the smell it gives you in your groin mainly and still take the supplement fenugreek ,and when you do stop the effects go away including smell and growth,I took it for 9-10 months and the growth was not enough to justify the smell, have you looked into Swanson bovine glandular supplements?

Are you using this, and if so, is it a better option, with better results?

[Nipply Russel]

Hello and welcome. I have two comments:

1. Please check out Red Clover. You might consider adding it to your regimen.

2. Pueraria mirifica seems to be much more potent than the others at promoting feminine changes. In just a few weeks, I developed buds - sore glandular material under my nipples that are the foundation of real female breasts. Plus, my ejaculate changed, I've had fewer erections, and my low dose (500mg/day) has had a minor effect on my mood/thinking. From my perspective, PM will get you much closer to HRT than the stuff you've been taking. And it's easy to get, but you'll probably have to order it online.

Best of luck to you.

[VergeOfDiscovery]

Re: a better option, with better results

There are a number of options available, but if you've had positive results from simply fenugreek, then I would look into PM (Ainterol or Barlowes) before BO (Swanson or other) glandulars.

PM (Pueraria mirifica) with an alternating massage of fenugreek and PC (progesterone cream) may lead to major boobage! These hit different aspects of what makes for breasts (fenugreek being the most temporal of the lot).

BO may be a good path for some, but it may take longer to see anything from that approach (so some that have started with PM and have seen some results may explore BO...later).

[Beverley50]

"Pueraria mirifica seems to be much more potent than the others at promoting feminine changes"

I've been reading reference to PM before but never realized that it is Pueraria mirifica, and will investigate red clover too. It is a very exciting time for me and I discover new names and products every day. I think the trick is to find a good combination of only a few products (that work for you personally), and then sticking to them and allow your body to get used to them over a longer sustained period.

Thank you.