[Mindhak]

I see people on here say HRT is more E then PM, but I also see people posting changes sooner on PM then HRT.  Am I missing something?

[Heaven's Night]

PM is not bioidentical estradiol. Its phytopestrogen which mimics its effects. Its not the same thing, its much weaker and slower to change things. PM might cause more just boobs only, but bioidentical estradiol will cause over all feminisation, everything, the whole deal. You're comparing apples to oranges, they're totally different in almost every aspect.

HRT is not slower, it is faster to make bigger changes because its more than just growing some boobs. Conventional HRT should not be toyed with. It will transition your body to female in such fundamental level. A cis man doing it will likely feel terrible and should never do it unless they're not a cis man at all. So proceed with caution as conventional HRT is much much stronger than any phytoestrogen on its own will ever be.

And there is no question which one is better, HRT always wins hands down in everything, but its not something anyone should do without careful consideration.

[wee2er]

DD is correct, PM/herbs are very different than HRT.
I started on PM, then as I wanted a more overall feminine look I switched to HRT, although I'm still male staying male.
As such it depends on your goals so being very simplistic PM/herbs = breasts and HRT = overall femininity

[LisaM]

Mindhak

I'll add to that you can't really 'pick n mix' what HRT or any supplement will do to you, your body will change according to your genetic makeup, you won't be able to pick large breasts but keep sexual function the same as before for example. You get what you get and that varies from person to person. It's not something to experiment on, commit or don't, there is no fence sitting with HRT so be very sure what it is that you want.

[OOO]

PM is not bioidentical estradiol. Its phytopestrogen which mimics its effects. Its not the same thing, its much weaker and slower to change things. PM might cause more just boobs only, but bioidentical estradiol will cause over all feminisation, everything, the whole deal. You're comparing apples to oranges, they're totally different in almost every aspect.

HRT is not slower, it is faster to make bigger changes because its more than just growing some boobs. Conventional HRT should not be toyed with. It will transition your body to female in such fundamental level. A cis man doing it will likely feel terrible and should never do it unless they're not a cis man at all. So proceed with caution as conventional HRT is much much stronger than any phytoestrogen on its own will ever be.

And there is no question which one is better, HRT always wins hands down in everything, but it’s not something anyone should do without careful consideration.

DiDi

Thanks a bunch, this is the info I’ve been looking for.  As I’m trying to obtain the total feminization package.  After starting the conventional HRT and T blockers, I have never felt better in my whole entire life, body and mind. I’m completely committed, turning back isn’t an option. I’m finally at peace with myself.

So, are you saying give the HRT and T  blockers time to work and add no BO or PM etc.

Pooky

[Heaven's Night]

Its up to you if you want to go on clean HRT or add some NBE elements to it... Obviously both do work fine, lot of people do great on just conventional HRT. I'm all for mix and match with NBE stuff obviously as my experience on it has been so positive, but that's just me.

At least maybe you should look into ways to boost HGH and IGF-1 along with it as that's also generally good for health and might give boobs a boost.

[OOO]

DiDi

Thanks for the input, much appreciated and treasured.  I may be old school but there is nothing like experience.  I will definitely research.

Thanks.
Pooky

[CM213]

Lara, you're a wealth of knowledge and experience. I hope you're doing well and everything is going nice and you're settling in after your move. 

When ever someone says try to find a way to increase your high levels I can't help but think of the 50 ius of pre mixed hgh powder I have left over from my body building years. I wonder what would be a good dose to help things along when doing nbe or hrt. I know most of my friends always suggested that 1-2 iu is typically for general health and wellness, feeling good etc. 2-4 is great for trying to recover from an injury or what not, 4-8 or more is body building range. Granted it's something one has to take for a long time to see any benefits from. Especially in terms of bodybuilding. But I wonder how much it would increase a nbe regimen or hrt program even at the low dose of 1-2 IU per day. At that dose o could easily stretch it out to 50 days or 100 if I do 1 IU every other day before bed.

[Heaven's Night]

I don't know about straight HGH, how to dose it. Other than it is likely that for fem body changes not much is needed? Just because from experience I know what exercise and taking amino acids etc., does and that HGH boost isn't crazy a lot, nowhere near what body builders might do, so likely a small dose could be very effective on this purpose. Also time is better multiplier than dose very often, so typically its a good idea to take NBE stuff in moderation and let it take its time.

But for growth hormone, I really don't know, this is just my best guess. Obviously not overdoing it is the way to go.

[CM213]

Yes that's what I was thinking as well, the smallest dose of actual growth hormone over the long haul might help in overall development. Just like all nbe stuff and like you said time is the ultimate factory. I think like anything else, it's like compounding interest,The longer you stay with it, and be consistent, the greater the returns. Apply that to nbe and in the long run one day maybe we all can have great breasts like yours Lara.